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Loot changes

Atome
Lee Hammock
Just to warn people there are some loot changes on the next update:

1. The tutorial goblins will no longer drop any loot of any kind.
2. No low level monsters will drop armor. The weapon drops will continue for the short term but will likely be ending in a few weeks as well.

So stockpile your +0 tier 1 gear so you can sell it to the people who come later.
Good news!
SENSOU - War is coming!
Wolf of Rathglen
If this is to stop the ridiculous recipe farming from starter goblins then just take out the recipes, tokens, and coin from their tables so there is no point to killing them except the tutorial quest and if you're a new character after starting gear.

As an armor smith I *KNOW* I'm not going to make +0 for the market - the raw inputs have a minimum value for their use in T1+2 armor which makes +0 armor way too expensive for first day players who start with no copper. T1+0 is entirely separate from the blossoming economic system. The only reason to take an unlimited +0 spigot out of the game is if there was scrapping for crafting materials, which there isn't.

Armor +0 is already incredibly hard to find with just a club/wand/focus/shortbow as it is. If you take starter gear off the starter mobs, you'll be leaving new players without a source of +0 gear unless you put it into the tutorials (where I think it should have been all this time anyway).
Hammerfall: Like a waterfall, but tougher.
Jokken
I think those outraged by this proposed change are looking at things the wrong way. This is a game that focuses on survival through cooperation. You start as a spiritual refugee with nothing in your pockets in a hostile land. Starting with nothing and looking to depend on others to get started reinforces that feel. I suggest that this change will give a reason for settlements to stockpile a bit of +0 armor, weapons, and implements to use for recruiting. "Are you new here? Join company X, these are our beliefs and goals. If you join us we'll give you a set of starter equipment for your class" Hate that idea and want to go it alone? Well, do the starter quests and go forth into the hexes around town kill those goblins, bandit recruits, and omega wolves to farm the gear. This is a positive change and it's not unexpected. It was announced long ago that starter mobs would only drop starter gear long enough to get the _first_ wave of players in the game on their feet. It's that group of players that is then responsible for getting the next group of players on their feet.
Go West for freedom and adventure! Join the free soil settlers of High Road. Be a positive and constructive force for freedom in the Bulwark Hills. www.coalroad.com/hrc
Chance Wyvernspur
From a personal perspective, as a person who played in Alpha, I wouldn't find this change to be a big deal. Its is pretty easy to run out of town with just a club and shortbow, go anywhere in the world, and knock off goblins and bandits wherever you find them. I only used the "starter gobos" to kill 50 in order to buy some starter feats. They were convenient.

But thinking of new players, their expectations are going to be that they must have armor before they leave town. Its an "adventurer" thing to do. The world is supposed to be dangerous and adventurers wear armor. Tabletop players will want to be able to spend their 150gp to buy starting equipment. Once they realize they cannot start with equipment, they're not going to immediately assume they can just run off into the dangerous world and survive.

Yet, in reality, they can. There just probably won't be any veteran players standing there in the starter town to say, "Yep, club, shortbow, you're good. Go kill things. If you're working a group, kill one with your bow and run, repeat."
Chance Wyvernspur
Chance Wyvernspur
Just an odd idea. Why not start new characters with some credit at a newbie store? The newbie store could sell no-drop, no-trade starter gear. That is, gear that is less durable than normal gear. Then a new character can "feel" like they are equipped and the veteran characters have no means, nor motivation, to use the starter gear.

Another option is (as others have said) modifying the loot tables for the starter gobos. I'd see this as a temporary solution. Indeed, I see the starter gobos as a temporary solution in and of themselves. They make no sense standing there with their Thornguard babysitters.

Yet another option is to only have the starter gobos drop anything if the character who killed them has killed fewer than 50 goblins.
Chance Wyvernspur
Gog
Add a newby quest for one set of light, medium, or heavy +0 armor.
^This is Dak (Charlie George). RIP <Guurzak>
Nihimon
Another important thing to keep in mind is that these changes were likely implemented solely by the designers changing some spreadsheets, without requiring programmer time. Any suggestions that involve programmer time are unlikely to be done right away.
Nihimon murmurs in sheer ecstasy as the magic courses through his veins
Yrme
If they can adjust the drops through a spreadsheet, like Nihimon says, it's not programming a major change. They're just adjusting the drop-dial.

My assumption is that they have visibility on the number of items, resources, etc., that we've collected to date. If the devs are dialing back the drops, that likely means there's enough gear and resources in our hands to build the economy. We just have to do that.

As for player quests for armor. Soldier chain can be made from 20 coal and 20 iron (28/28 for +1). I'm expecting at least one player group will be offering +1 soldier chain as a "quest reward" for harvesting 40 iron and 40 coal.
At some point, crowdforging suggestions seem to be like fan fiction. Some good, some bad, some repetitious and predictable. But maybe there are some gems out there.
Nihimon
Urman
My assumption is that they have visibility on the number of items, resources, etc., that we've collected to date.

I don't think that's a good assumption. From Check Recipes?:

Stephen Cheney
Recipe drop chances should be global and have no concept of their regional position (i.e., the same creature should have the same drop chances for everything no matter where you encounter them).

Our working hypothesis is normally that the random number generator, being pretty random, can be streaky. There's no code put in to try to break streaks of higher or lower results, so you could sometimes find yourself on the far ends of the randomness bell curve.

But I've heard enough reports from people getting large amounts of loot that the streaks seem pretty large that it's hard for me to totally discount error reports. For the time being, we're going to have to ask people that are concerned about it to try to be as accurate as possible in tracking your drops (both runs of good and bad luck) so we get a better feel for what's going on. Hopefully we'll get some logging tools soon so we can have a real global record of what's entering the system and where.

However, I completely agree with your conclusion:

Urman
… that likely means there's enough gear and resources in our hands to build the economy. We just have to do that.
Nihimon murmurs in sheer ecstasy as the magic courses through his veins
Being
If the starting goblins standing solo in a ring around the starter town drop loot then there will be people who should be off adventuring farming them who are already equipped. The new player just entering the game needs those goblins, but older lowbies want their monopoly PLUS if they can frustrate the new player sufficiently the newb will attack them, making themselves an easy and painless kill. The reputation system cannot render justice where the new player can be baited like that.

I think it a good thing measure. Just let those goblins and bandit recruits outside in the wilderness still drop gear.
Lo, the mighty Oak. Just a little nut who stood his ground!
 
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