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10 days

Elsworth Sugarfoot
The biggest problem I see with real-time XP is that eventually new players will not be able to compete. Even in a few months the players that join up will be significantly far behind those of us playing now. In a year those of us who started now will severely overpower new players and they'll have no way of catching up. This makes it very unattractive to join the game. I spoke with a friend who plays EVE a few years ago and it just didn't seem fun to join and always be far behind with no way to catch up even if I played a ton and was willing to grind. Eventually, new players won't join up and old players will get bored and leave.
Thod-Theodum
Chidar

Let me tell you that you 'do it wrong'. Not wrong in what you want the game to be but in the way you approach it. This is a sandbox game. You can't get ahead by grinding XP - but there are other ways:

You are saying part of the problem is to spend XP on things like crafting. As a settlement leader who worked out the ecomomy and who tried to keep my own people happy I worked out the following options

1) Do it yourself (cast you lots of XP and I don't see it feasible - surely not for tier 2 gear unless your time horizon is several years of gaming)
2) Buy stuff. The auction house isn't working - fair enough. But I know Schedim is peddling his wares with you. USE him. For the right price there are places that sell stuff. I just auctioned off a Tier 2 Dwarven Steel Banded +1 and I'm about to sell a second. There is nothing better right out there in this game and all that is needed is a Unbreakable 6 to use. Other items will be cheaper.
3) Don't offend the wrong people. Sensou threatens our coal supply as your preferred hunting ground is around Iron Gauntlet. Acts like that have consequences and something I might give for free to a newbie coming to EL might cost you double or becomes unavailable. Nothing wrong with angering people - just be aware whom you anger and that there are consequences. And it works both ways. I'm about to approach you leader for a deal and Ortallus Vin might cost me now more because of his stagger here on this boards.
4) Get into a settlement that supplies equipment for you. Off course you have to think what the benefit of a settlement is to take you in.

Everyone plays by the same rules and restrictions. You need to find ways how to use them towards your own playstyle. So when I say you 'do it wrong' then I mean it isn't necessarily you playstyle (PvP) that is wrong - it is your inability to adapt to the game. We are in crowdforging - some minor bits can be changed - but some major ones might not.

You mentioned you don't mind grinding monsters - as long as you advance your character. What you miss is that one of my players 'grinding monsters' paid me 10 times the amount of the armor that I sold - just by handing in the drops from his grinding of monsters for the use of my settlement.

This game is XP AND Equipment. A Unbreakable 6 is useless unless you have a tier 2 armour to go with it. Fighter 8 - useless unless you can back it up with a tier 2 weapon. A tier 2 longsword costs around 100 days of XP. Smelter 8, Weaponsmith 9, Tanner 7. Tier 2 recipes (the right ones) have a HUGE value. Tier 1 recipes still have some value. You get these grinding monsters and I'm sure if you don't like barter and trade then Schedim is very happy to do it for you (and getting his own cut).

The game won't change dramatically towards your game style. But sometimes it only needs some adjustments to align your own play style with the game. And yes - politics and knowing people is as important as being a good PvP player or being the highest level fighter around. Maybe sometimes even more important.

Bottom line - economy, politics and fighting are all interrelated. You can't ignore them. But you can outsource the parts you are not interested in and adapt.
Thod/Theodum are the OOC/IC leaders of the Emerald Lodge - a neutral settlement in the center of the mal that tries to the first to explore the Emerald Spire - should that part of the game ever become available. We have a strong in game and out of game relationship with the Pathfinder Society.
We welcome both hard core players as well as casual players with or without tabletop experience. We have a strong group in Europe and are slowly expanding into the US. We are predominately PvE as our neutral political stance means that we tend to use PvP only in self-defence. We are not anti-PVP - but expect limited PvP opportunity with us.
Chidar
@Thod,

1. 'doing it wrong'? Yes I clearly want a different game developed over the next 2 years than other people.
2. I know its an attempt at a sandbox, of which I have played many.
3. I am bored out of my skull right now, as there is no reason to log in and play. That goes for many of my friends as well. We are constantly waiting for exp, and there isn't enough sand in the box.
4. Finally we kill people, they bitch and moan, harass and goad. As for Vin, he comes in the special category. Plenty of screen shots if you want them. They start with him bitching, and me telling him to stop talking to me, then move to him continuing to goad me with "you kid" and insult me with "go fk yourself", followed by me laughing and telling him he is behaving like a sissy. All because he got killed. So he reports me and continues to send me insults / provocations, i continue to tell him to stop talking to me. Ofc he doesn't and continues to try and annoy and goad me. I stop reading chat. If you want to read it for yourself, i will post it to u-tube with his name and company. If he has reported me and i get a warning, he goes straight to the top of my personal murdering KOS list, and i don't care what company he is in. I don't want him removed from the game for harassment. I have the opinion if you can't take it then don't dish it out.
6. I don't care about politics, I don't want anything to do with company stuff, i just want to pvp. I leave that up to you and my company leader.
7. without company name tags - its impossible in the pursuit of pvp not to 'offend' sometimes, (kill the wrong people). I don't generally loot a husk anyway, so just take it on the chin and get your stuff back, and if you stand still i will cease my attack. I am here for the challenge, and only for the challenge. thre are plenty of people I have killed who have got their stuff back and discussed the fight with me without telling me to go f… myself.
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Chidar
6. I don't care about politics, I don't want anything to do with company stuff, i just want to pvp.
Unfortunately (for you), this is the specific attitude that the developers are working hard to avoid in game.

"politics and company stuff" are PvP as are trading and a number of other mechanics. PvP is not only about people fighting each other with weapons. You are saying you are only interested in a particular bit of PvP that the developers are intent on making sure doesn't make up the bulk of the game. You may never be satisfied with PFO.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Thod-Theodum
Chidar
I'm trying to help make this game better. One part of this is to ensure motivation for my own people. They need something meaningful to do. There is a big problem for PvP players to find opponents. There isn't enough PvP opportunity around to currently keep this alone as a play focus.
Maybe this changes once settlement warefare comes in - but even then you have to be in the 'right' settlement. Some will try to stay out of war if possible.
About you are here for a challenge - this is a problem in itself. 80% of the time I run around in my gatherer armour because it allows me to carry more while still I'm well enough protected against the random monster in which I run. To be a challenge I have to change into my battle gear - which is back in the bank.
And as Caldeathe says - 'politics and company stuff' are PVP. It is PvP on a different level.

And thanks to let me know about the behaviour of Vin. I will follow this up.
Thod/Theodum are the OOC/IC leaders of the Emerald Lodge - a neutral settlement in the center of the mal that tries to the first to explore the Emerald Spire - should that part of the game ever become available. We have a strong in game and out of game relationship with the Pathfinder Society.
We welcome both hard core players as well as casual players with or without tabletop experience. We have a strong group in Europe and are slowly expanding into the US. We are predominately PvE as our neutral political stance means that we tend to use PvP only in self-defence. We are not anti-PVP - but expect limited PvP opportunity with us.
Chidar
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Chidar
6. I don't care about politics, I don't want anything to do with company stuff, i just want to pvp.
Unfortunately, this is the specific attitude that the developers are working hard to avoid in game.

"politics and company stuff" are PvP. PvP is not only about people fighting each other with weapons. You are saying you are only interested in a particular bit of PvP that the developers are intent on making sure doesn't make up the bulk of the game. You may never be satisfied with PFO.

ok alf your post is wrong the other part is right.
1. Just wanting to pvp is NOT an 'attitude', its just combat against a player, hence 'player verses player'.
2. The developers are not trying to avoid non-consensual pvp, you should read their pvp mission statement properly. You are a role player right? then consider me a murderer, hope that helps.
3. You want to know my attitude? Ok here is my attitude towards players regarding pvp. I will combat anyone for the challenge, if they are not challenging or surrender (stand still) i cease fighting them. If they are a worthy combatant i might loot them, more often i will leave the husk unsullied.
4. On your point of 'pvp is not all about fighting people with weapons', no sometimes i use words like 'your dead lay down' or 'please fall over this banana skin and play dead' or 'give me your settlement without a fight'. This works for you?
5. It is painfully clear to anyone who knows anything about pvp that you have confused your words or what you are trying to convey. Let me help you:
PvP is tactical combat (fighting stuff), player killing is another term for it.
Politics and company stuff - are strategic stuff / organisational non combat stuff.
I think you have incorrectly generalized your understanding of pvp.
Try reading this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_versus_player

So the bit i may agree with you on is PFO may not be the game for me if they continue to listen to the 'crowd' who know little about pvp or confuse it with something else, and vote this development into a mediocre product. But then again it might be the Dev's know what i have said already, and are trying to strike a balance.
Chidar
Thod
Chidar
I'm trying to help make this game better. One part of this is to ensure motivation for my own people. They need something meaningful to do. There is a big problem for PvP players to find opponents. There isn't enough PvP opportunity around to currently keep this alone as a play focus.
Maybe this changes once settlement warefare comes in - but even then you have to be in the 'right' settlement. Some will try to stay out of war if possible.
About you are here for a challenge - this is a problem in itself. 80% of the time I run around in my gatherer armour because it allows me to carry more while still I'm well enough protected against the random monster in which I run. To be a challenge I have to change into my battle gear - which is back in the bank.
And as Caldeathe says - 'politics and company stuff' are PVP. It is PvP on a different level.

And thanks to let me know about the behaviour of Vin. I will follow this up.

Thod,
politics and company stuff are not pvp, they are politics and company stuff.
I absolutely know what you are saying about 'politics' etc and yes they play a part as far as when or who to fight. But don't confuse pvp with strategy - company vs company politics (which is an appropriate term).Player versus player is tactical combat. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_versus_player

I don't believe you are new to pvp, you know how these games will go, settlements will stagnate, wars will be few and far between, you need non-consensual pvp to keep the game going. I get your point tho - perhaps yes I am here too early.
Decius
Player(s) versus player(s), or PvP, is a type of multiplayer interactive conflict within a game between two or more live participants.

That seems to cover both killing random PC characters and the unreleased settlement warfare modules.
Gog
I think there's a perfectly valid role for Chidar and his ilk in PFO. He wants to be a weapon; what he needs is a wielder. Under the direction of a politically-engaged leader who can choose targets and point him at them, I suspect he'd be perfectly happy.
^This is Dak (Charlie George). RIP <Guurzak>
Chidar
Guurzak
I think there's a perfectly valid role for Chidar and his ilk in PFO. He wants to be a weapon; what he needs is a wielder. Under the direction of a politically-engaged leader who can choose targets and point him at them, I suspect he'd be perfectly happy.

Holy shazbuttly! Guurzak defending my position! *feints*.
Wow, seriously my opinion of you has greatly shot up.
 
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