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Why is influence required to PvP?

Yrme
Daeglin
They could take and hold a holding.
They could claim a "valuable" spot and charge a toll.
They could be a mercenary company.
They could be Merry Men.

Couple off the top of my head.

Yup. The first would require Influence, but doesn't require a PC settlement. The other three could even be done without Influence. Once we have settlement warfare, the third one becomes much more accessible for a group that eschews gaining Influence through PvE or gathering.

'Unsanctioned' PvP can still be meaningful PvP; I think the key is that the attacker has to weigh some cost against his objectives, and if the company is willing to pay in Reputation, they can pull other players into PvP. Whether the Reputation cost is worth it - that is a meaningful decision.
At some point, crowdforging suggestions seem to be like fan fiction. Some good, some bad, some repetitious and predictable. But maybe there are some gems out there.
Decius
Banditry costs Reputation. Because that is how Reputation is supposed to work, to discourage killing people and taking their stuff "just because".

The average act of killing someone is more meaningful when the attacker pays a price, and Relutation is about the right price based on the small amount of commentary I've seen from people who ran out.
Bringslite
The influence mechanic is broken. PVPer's can't afford to feud until it costs the correct amount. At least not penalty free.

Can unaffiliated Companies get and apply influence? If not, that needs fixing too. It has been bandied about that completely free companies can throw down a holding if they want. They can't without influence.

They should still have to do the same work as anyone else, but there should be more ways to do it.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Yrme
Bringslite
Can unaffiliated Companies get and apply influence? If not, that needs fixing too. It has been bandied about that completely free companies can throw down a holding if they want. They can't without influence.

We recently shifted a company from Brighthaven to Keeper's Pass; due to Paizocon and people's schedules, the company was unaffiliated for 2 days or so. Its influence was never dropped and its holdings remained in place. That seems to be working 100% according to design. Has there been some problem of 6+ character companies earning influence?
At some point, crowdforging suggestions seem to be like fan fiction. Some good, some bad, some repetitious and predictable. But maybe there are some gems out there.
Midnight
Decius
Midnight
Decius
Purely PvP settlements should not be able to exist. Settlement should have to be fully engaged with every aspect of the game- and currently they have to be in order to thrive.

Exploring the map for resource locations and quantities is already a major thing; gathering and crafting those resources is likewise critical; PvE is absolutely required, and in massive amounts if we are to ever make +5 holding kits. PvP to protect all of that.

None of those major types of gameplay can be effectively outsourced to a different settlement, although they can be done partially.

I am talking only of providing a pure PvP *COMPANY* options to engage in sanctioned combat PvP from day one through the first 2 months before they eventually have to join or seize settlements.

Players who want meaningless PvP with other people that also desire meaningless PvP can join the Rhed or Blew team and fight as much as they want. If they want to have meaningless PvP they can take the rep hit or spend the time to get influence to feud random targets.

Have I said that they seek meaningless PvP? They want SANCTIONED PvP. Some of you settlement aristocrats seem to think that companies exist only to serve you, and are otherwise meaningless.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Flari
Yrme
Bringslite
Can unaffiliated Companies get and apply influence? If not, that needs fixing too. It has been bandied about that completely free companies can throw down a holding if they want. They can't without influence.

We recently shifted a company from Brighthaven to Keeper's Pass; due to Paizocon and people's schedules, the company was unaffiliated for 2 days or so. Its influence was never dropped and its holdings remained in place. That seems to be working 100% according to design. Has there been some problem of 6+ character companies earning influence?

Not that I am aware of. As pointed out elsewhere, the game is very grindy if you try to push for acieves. When you just play, the achieves sneak up and happen. smile
flari@mail.com
Midnight
Decius
Tigari
Decius, are you even reading what he's typing or just auto quoting him? No where did he mention MEANINGLESS pvp, it's actually the opposite, he's trying to steer new players who want to pvp into a MEANINGFUL pvp. Stop putting words into his mouth so to say. First it was pure pvp settlements and now meaningless pvp.. Come on man
What kind of meaningful PvP can an unaffiliated PvP only company aspire to?

Someone above already posted a good list.

And if there isn't enough for them to do, maybe the game also needs more stuff added to the possible activities list for EE67. :-)

But this month we just eliminated open PvP windows unless you spend influence, so now on your first day the ONLY non-artificial PvP left to a new company is villainy. GIANT… STEP… BACKWARDS.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Midnight
Yrme
'Unsanctioned' PvP can still be meaningful PvP; I think the key is that the attacker has to weigh some cost against his objectives, and if the company is willing to pay in Reputation, they can pull other players into PvP. Whether the Reputation cost is worth it - that is a meaningful decision.

But if they pay that rep cost they get KOS listed and vilified (as well as perhaps chasing PvE-ers from the game). We need a way for newbie PvP to not poison our community. Maybe Newbies really are so inconsequential that they should be left to artificial staged attacker flagging duels, but when I see 6 of them on my mini-map, I see actual power. Power that is wasted on meaningless skirmishes, as well as a wasted opportunity for us to gradually draw them into the deeper game without actually coercing them into joining existing settlements their first day/week/month.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Duffy Swiftshadow
Serious question, why is a newbie company that has nothing and is associated with no one PvPing? Isn't that kinda the wrong lesson to teach according to the game's design philosophy? Shouldn't they be joining an established company if they just want to jump into things?
Midnight
Duffy Swiftshadow
Serious question, why is a newbie company that has nothing and is associated with no one PvPing? Isn't that kinda the wrong lesson to teach according to the game's design philosophy? Shouldn't they be joining an established company if they just want to jump into things?

The fact that they have nothing doesn't mean they don't aspire to having anything. But a new company may value good gear, for example, over the stuff a settlement values. Would you trade me 90 hunter longbows +0 for this tower I seem to have recently acquired? :-)

They certainly can join another company, but they lose their identity and autonomy. I don't claim a perfect understanding of the game's design philosophy, but I do know they wanted new players to have some time (albeit limited) before being coerced into settlements. The problem is that because the window of being a viable indie company is so brief, most (I dare speculate ALL) the companies with enough influence to keep PvPers busy have already bent a knee and joined a settlement.

And up until the influence patch, indies could PvP for towers. Towers are valued (by some people), and using sanctioned PvP to gain and hold things people value gives you tradeworthy assets. It hasn't really happened much (if at all), though, because GW sets indie company PvP windows at 24 hours. But there are groups joining this summer who can cover all timezones with numbers great enough (at least considering how small the current population of PvPers is) to have seriously considered that option if they did a good combination of diplomacy and picking their targets carefully.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
 
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