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Bulk Resources Future Increased Weight

Brighthaven Leader
LOL Edam, and then if they want more than a few of the bulk goods, they have to take the mule allllll the way back to where they came from.
Brighthaven is a Neutral Good settlement focused on defending its citizens and its allies from negative fringe based PvP (Player Killing and Griefing) while striving to become a large and shining beacon for Good. Whether you wish to benefit from this protection or you love PvP and wish to assist in providing this protection, Brighthaven aims to be the home and support center for you!
Daeglin
Edam
Thing is its probably not really going to even provide much in the way of meaningful PvP becasue really are you going to fight to save 200 Bulk Stone ?

Or you could turn it around and say, are you going to fight to deny 200 Bulk Stone to your enemy?
Good… Bad… I'm the guy with the bow.
Edam
Daeglin
Edam
Thing is its probably not really going to even provide much in the way of meaningful PvP becasue really are you going to fight to save 200 Bulk Stone ?

Or you could turn it around and say, are you going to fight to deny 200 Bulk Stone to your enemy?

Its still only 200 stone there are settlement stockpile of some bulk goods getting up in the tens of thousands already.
Thod-Theodum
I think the bit that the PvP crowd here misses is

Lower weight of bulk items = less grind to transport = more bulk good on a mule = more profitable target

Bloodwolf always would harp on risk and reward need to be balanced. The issue with making bulk too heavy is that there just isn't a meaningful reward.
Thod/Theodum are the OOC/IC leaders of the Emerald Lodge - a neutral settlement in the center of the mal that tries to the first to explore the Emerald Spire - should that part of the game ever become available. We have a strong in game and out of game relationship with the Pathfinder Society.
We welcome both hard core players as well as casual players with or without tabletop experience. We have a strong group in Europe and are slowly expanding into the US. We are predominately PvE as our neutral political stance means that we tend to use PvP only in self-defence. We are not anti-PVP - but expect limited PvP opportunity with us.
Ravenlute
Lower weight of items = less reason to use a mule in the first place.
Myl - Herald of Stone Bear Clan (Tavernhold)
"You can walk into Tavernhold but a horse will have to carry you out."
Brighthaven Leader
.25 Encumbrance is way tooo low, I personally like 1 Encumbrance, but I believe 5 is too much.

I think there is a better goldielocks zone.
Brighthaven is a Neutral Good settlement focused on defending its citizens and its allies from negative fringe based PvP (Player Killing and Griefing) while striving to become a large and shining beacon for Good. Whether you wish to benefit from this protection or you love PvP and wish to assist in providing this protection, Brighthaven aims to be the home and support center for you!
Thod-Theodum
+1 for Cheatle
I also think the 1 encumbrance is closer to the sweet spot as 0.25 or 5. 0.25 is too little - you can transport too much without needing a mule. 5 is too much.
I have been using close to 1 mule / day lately. And while I didn't optimize them I would have needed extra travels with higher bulk goods. Also didn't we have a discussion somewhere about cost of transport - could we link to that.

What is the difference in cost to transport 1000 bulk Forgeholm to Emerald Lodge based on some early formula (was it SSpitfire? I know I helped to contribute but that seems ages ago). There is a point where long range trade becomes meaningless as transport costs becomes excessive.
Thod/Theodum are the OOC/IC leaders of the Emerald Lodge - a neutral settlement in the center of the mal that tries to the first to explore the Emerald Spire - should that part of the game ever become available. We have a strong in game and out of game relationship with the Pathfinder Society.
We welcome both hard core players as well as casual players with or without tabletop experience. We have a strong group in Europe and are slowly expanding into the US. We are predominately PvE as our neutral political stance means that we tend to use PvP only in self-defence. We are not anti-PVP - but expect limited PvP opportunity with us.
Brighthaven Leader
Depending on how many times you get stuck, it will take 1 hr 15 mins to 1 hr and 30 mins to mule from EL to FH.

So that is a 2.5 to 3 hours round trip, for 1000 bulk resources (or 1500 after mediums bags are fixed) OR if they change the weight to 5, that would be 12.5 to 15 hours for the same amounts.

Now you could take more mules, but that becomes even more dangerous risk vs reward situation. Also, with carrying more now, its faster but you risk a lot more. Should you take a team of mules? How much protection do you need?

Beside Golgotha there are people killing (newbies from what I hear, possibly even a new company) around TK, so there is actually some risk there, although you could pretty much avoid all risk, if you go around the mountains, towards Ozems/Callambea, and up through Black Feather area, but that will take 50% longer.

That is just time and risk vs reward, now if you want to take into consideration man hours, that is a whole other can of worms. Do you take a full group with you? 6 people protecting one mule, I mean right now that is 15 to 18 man hours, to make a pretty sizeable drop off, if they change the weight that would be 75 to 90 man hours to transport the same amount of goods. A lot more risk for a lot less of a reward.

Usually, you need to base everything around the average play session (which I believe is 2-3 hours) and balance the risk vs reward for a group of people playing together. Is it too tough? too boring? takes too long? is the risk high enough? is the reward high enough for selling those goods? Bulk resources are going to be the life's blood of this server soon, so do we want to make transporting it that much harder?

I am not asking for an easy button, but is we go off hard is fun, to me the hard part is logistics, then risk vs reward of it being attacked or stolen. Right now the latter part isn't as big of an issue unless you are around some certain areas of the map or at war, but later on its going to matter, and if it takes hours and hours to transport 1 days (I realize its a per week cost) settlement payment of goods GWs goal of having us trade across the map is going to go further into the toilet, (I mean as it is, about half the settlements are self-sufficient or sufficient within alliances as is) the longer it takes to transport the more ways everyone is going to look to become self-sufficient even more so, or just not attempt to trade at all.
Brighthaven is a Neutral Good settlement focused on defending its citizens and its allies from negative fringe based PvP (Player Killing and Griefing) while striving to become a large and shining beacon for Good. Whether you wish to benefit from this protection or you love PvP and wish to assist in providing this protection, Brighthaven aims to be the home and support center for you!
Doc
It seems to me that the most interesting option, which is to get a big group together to run the mules and provide security, was written off by you as too dangerous?

If you guys have been able to muster a dozen or more people to farm Tier2/3 escalations, probably for an hour or more at a time, I'd believe (maybe I'm wrong?) you'd be able to get a similar turnout for a group activity that keeps the settlement alive.

That method might seem more dangerous, though perhaps quicker, but then I think that is what Goblin Works is trying to do. I think they are actively trying their best to stymie the attempts of people to play this game in the safest yet laborious way possible, so as to increase the amount of conflict and interesting interactions in game.

Do you agree that Goblin Works seems to be trying to funnel people more and more into group-based play as the more effective way to accomplish higher-end goals in game?
Thod-Theodum
@Doc
It just makes NO economic sense. Current cost of 1 bulk good is in the area of 0.5 silver pieces. One mule loaded with 200 bulk goods would be 1 gp worth.

This amount isn't worth spending 10 man hours of guard duty. Ask yourself - can I give you 10 SP and you move a mule from EL to Forgeholm and back? I'm not paying much more than that as the transport and guarding becomes more expensive as the good itself.

GW won't be able to funnel any PvP or banditry into the game UNLESS they stop production of certain bulk completely in certain areas. But then start with resources. Give the NW a 100% coal monopoly and you force trade. At the same time you might kill the game as it is a dangerous balance to get right.

Walking a caravan with protection is like protecting the towers - and we know that the war of towers didn't work. Do we have a war or mules or will it just be nobody will show up? My bet is on the latter.
Thod/Theodum are the OOC/IC leaders of the Emerald Lodge - a neutral settlement in the center of the mal that tries to the first to explore the Emerald Spire - should that part of the game ever become available. We have a strong in game and out of game relationship with the Pathfinder Society.
We welcome both hard core players as well as casual players with or without tabletop experience. We have a strong group in Europe and are slowly expanding into the US. We are predominately PvE as our neutral political stance means that we tend to use PvP only in self-defence. We are not anti-PVP - but expect limited PvP opportunity with us.
 
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