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Another perspective

Midnight
Edam
Rynnik
Gariwald
What is the game's actual state… ?
Fun.

More of an addictive timesuck really.

Addiction is such a strong term. I remember Rick Wilder of the Mau Maus once declaring "I'm not a heroin addict. I'm a heroin ENTHUSIAST".

My name is Midnight and I'm a Pathfinder Online enthusiast. :-)
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Gariwald
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Apparently investor does not mean what you think it means.

Yeah, because semantic is a very serious thing around here. What is the game's actual state… ? Alpha ? Beta ? Released ? Oh right, it's " Pay & don't complain ".
The game's state has nothing to do with thinking you are an investor.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Gariwald
Midnight
While crowdfunding *can* make one an investor nowadays, back when this game was on kickstarter it would have been illegal to solicit 500+ unaccredited investors over the internet.

Luckily… no share of the company or profits was ever offered to us so we're not part of a vast criminal conspiracy.

Which doesn't change the fact that it's stupid to pretend that we must think about the wishes of the investors, since there is essentially none.
Doc
I'm pretty sure Paizo is an investor in PFO to the tune of a million dollars or something.
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Gariwald
Which doesn't change the fact that it's stupid to pretend that we must think about the wishes of the investors, since there is essentially none.
Except the people who put up the roughly 3 (out of 4) million dollars that didn't come from the kickstarter.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Gariwald
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Gariwald
Which doesn't change the fact that it's stupid to pretend that we must think about the wishes of the investors, since there is essentially none.
Except the people who put up the roughly 3 (out of 4) million dollars that didn't come from the kickstarter.

The rest comes from Paizo. And Paizo's owners, are a part of PFO's team. And they got 1.3 mil, with both KS. And in the 4mil, don't forget every post-KS incomes, like alpha accounts, item-shop, and various accounts.

And the fact that the game was sold as a crowdforging experience anyway.

Do you think that if they had investors to look up to, Lisa could say things like "if the game becomes a murder simulation, I would rather stop it entirely" ? What do you think the investors would say ? "Yeah, if the game isn't your dream come true, don't hesitate to throw away our money in the trash, it's okay" ?

Come on. It's okay to defend your game, but you're not defending the game here, just some random preposterous statement from a guy. Even you can see that the point of PFO is, to go around investors.
Decius
I think Lisa was smart and reserved some rights as Paizo CEO to pull the plug on the Pathfinder license deal, and that had at least some negative effect on finding Goblinworks investors.

I bet she really can decide to shut down PFO if it starts harming the Pathfinder brand.
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Gariwald
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Gariwald
Which doesn't change the fact that it's stupid to pretend that we must think about the wishes of the investors, since there is essentially none.
Except the people who put up the roughly 3 (out of 4) million dollars that didn't come from the kickstarter.

The rest comes from Paizo. And Paizo's owners, are a part of PFO's team. And they got 1.3 mil, with both KS. And in the 4mil, don't forget every post-KS incomes, like alpha accounts, item-shop, and various accounts.
It appears you are saying that the investment of Paizo, and Ryan, and the other people who put money in does not make them investors, because they are connected with the company?

My impression (which could be wrong) is that the tech demo funds were separate from the budget that was discussed last year, so the original money is not part of the PFO budget.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Edam
Gariwald
Do you think that if they had investors to look up to, Lisa could say things like "if the game becomes a murder simulation, I would rather stop it entirely" ?

Let me translate that for you:

"If the game becomes a murder sim and hence threatens the tens of million we make out of the TT Piazo Pathfinder franchise every year we will pull the plug on it".

Even if Piazo were not the main investor they would still pull the plug on the licensing of the game if making it viable threatened their main franchise, that is just good business sense.
Gariwald
Caldeathe Baequiannia
It appears you are saying that the investment of Paizo, and Ryan, and the other people who put money in does not make them investors, because they are connected with the company?

My impression (which could be wrong) is that the tech demo funds were separate from the budget that was discussed last year, so the original money is not part of the PFO budget.

Except that contrary to what it was supposed to be, the tech is the actual engine. And I don't think that the team threw away all the computers and hardware and licenses they bought with the first ks.

And no, I'm not saying that Ryan & Lisa are not investors, I'm just saying that it's a stupid to say that the team must respect the investors wishes and conditions, since they don't have a board of shareholders to look up to like Bioware or Blizzard does. It's stupid to make a post about the big bad investors that the developers have to listen to, since it was the entire point of the game, to not do that.

When half your budget comes from your future clients, with the promise of crowd forging as a new paradigm, you can't ask the players to just accept what they get because of some investors.
 
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