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Whither Forever War?

Bringslite
Caldeathe Baequiannia
How about if we each focus on our own behaviour, and quit using quotes like weapons?

The game is in a rough state, and Lisa is trying to keep it alive for her and us. She has made an appeal to us to consider the affects of our actions on these forums as they affect potential white-knights. Phaeros is losing players because of too much PvP, EoX will lose players if they don't get enough PvP. Neither of those things will help the game. I don't have any solutions to that, but I don't think that getting angrier and angrier at each other is it.

More Word
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Beinion
Decius
I think that all of the name-calling is unproductive.
Agreed

I'm all for the debate and if anything I have said was seen as name calling I did not meen it that way.
Any time I have used the words griefing,griefers,or cheater it was directed at specific events and no one person or as a group as a whole. Just to the event
I think this would be a much better place without the name calling, public accusations without proof (both sides are guilty of this ),and direct attacks to people

I would also like to appoligize for my jumblefu*k of a post last night I was tired and angry and had way to many things running through my head that they all got mixed together. After reading it today I know it was a mess and may be really hard for ppl to understand what I was trying to say.
Bringslite
Midnight
IMO, it is the kind of thing an investor would want to see. Players with actual engagement in the game. A game where everyone recognizes that meaningful choices (even a year ago) have consequences.

I'm inclined to trust successful game development companies, their executive officers, and common sense to judge what kind of game forum posting is good for potential investors to read.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Midnight
Bringslite
Midnight
For the millionth time, no one is trying to get people to quit PFO.

Is there much difference if the result is the same? This wouldn't normally be an issue in a population healthy game.

This isn't a population healthy game. Someone has to take a higher road, if only for a little while.

Too little PvP ruins subscription retention of new players who would join EoX.

So backing off of PvP isn't an EoX population friendly solution.

Are YOU willing to make sacrifices? Like volunteer YOUR settlement for PvP in Phaeros' stead? Or would that ruin your player retention?

I think that before anyone chooses a higher ground everyone has to be convinced that whatever passes for a higher ground actually HELPS player retention. This may be unsolvable because the game risks losing players no matter what behavior gets changed or remains unchanged.

I personally have made sacrifices for the good of the community. I gave up banditry on 2/25/15 because the population wasn't dealing well with banditry. While banditry was great fun to roleplay and skipping it lessens my enjoyment, it wasn't essential for my continued play.

But any population wide "solution" that retains PvP averse players at the expense of losing PvP friendly players is a non-starter for me.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Midnight
Bringslite
Midnight
IMO, it is the kind of thing an investor would want to see. Players with actual engagement in the game. A game where everyone recognizes that meaningful choices (even a year ago) have consequences.

I'm inclined to trust successful game development companies, their executive officers, and common sense to judge what kind of game forum posting is good for potential investors to read.

I'll remind you that CCP is a successful game development company. What are YOU doing to make CCP want to invest?
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Edam
If EoX had ONLY wanted to PvP they could have created a pair of feuding companies EVE RvB style, placed them in different settlements and PvPed each other all day while waiting for the server population to increase.

Midnight
I'll remind you that CCP is successful game development company. What are YOU doing to make CCP want to invest?

CCP are struggling click on the 5Y link
Midnight
Edam
CCP are struggling click on the 5Y link

A) Goblinworks probably dreams of "struggling" like that.

B) Yes, banning the use of some of ISOBoxer's multi-boxing features cut the number of simultaneous logins.
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Midnight
Edam
If EoX had ONLY wanted to PvP they could have created a pair of feuding companies EVE RvB style, placed them in different settlements and PvPed each other all day while waiting for the server population to increase.

We've already been told that, come the day we are lacking an enemy, we will fight each other for Benevolent Dictator's amusement.

I'm not joking.

But below, I am joking…

If the server really wants to take the higher ground for the good of the game, perhaps everyone on the server should join Golgotha and Kreuz Bernstein so we can get started on that feud NOW. smile
He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Tyv Blodvaerd of Aragon
Midnight
any population wide "solution" that retains PvP averse players at the expense of losing PvP friendly players is a non-starter for me.

It is not just a non starter for you, it is a non continuer for the game.

The two most popular or anticipated Open World PvP Sandbox MMOs that are on the horizon are Crowfall and Albion Online. In both of the games PvP is zone based, as are higher tier resources. What Albion also did is it has PvP that is designed for small group PvP, as well as raid group sized PvP fir castle conquests. Its territorial control is based on 5v5, as well as dungeon raids in PvP zones. AO also has different rule sets for looting based on zones as well.

Crowfall has different zones that likewise have different rule sets based on the type of zone, but Crowfall is designed almost entirely as a territorial conquest game where when the workd is won, the map resets. The winner takes home the spoils, the loser either less or none.

Can PvP adverse players exist in either of those games, yes, but they have to accept being secondary / support characters. Just as a PvPer in a theme park must accept that their playstyle is secondary.

This is where the messaging of PFO, or the marketing of PFO went wrong. A game can not be equally focused on both, because the extremes can not coexist. Once a focus is decided the others outside if that focus needs to be told that they are in a support role. To not accept that reality is an extreme and potentially toxic view, especially if they are militant about it.
Aragon (CN) a settlement founded on the principles of the River Freedoms: Say What You Will; Oath Breakers Die; Walk Any Road, Float Any River; Courts are for Kings; Slavery is an Abomination; Have What You Hold.

Settlement Focus: Fighter and Rogue Training
Game Play: Escalations / Refining / Crafting / Defensive PVP
Tigari
tribuzio
Tigari
tribuzio
Now we don't fight and do what is fun for us. Result Golgotha is not winning even when they destroy the outposts, simply because they have way less fun

You really don't understand us do you lol? Sure, we enjoyed the actual fights, but burning holding is still fun, we all stand around, and BS with each other. Also, by you guys not showing up, a lot of EoX people count it as a "win". You guys chose that just loosing the holdings was less valuable then fighting us.. While it was the smart choice, specially since a lot of you guys don't enjoy the daily Pvp, it still felt like a win, and boosted morale. So possibly a win on both sides.

"Curiously" your burning down buildings has slowed noticeably in a few days, so I have some doubt about your statement that you find as much fun.

Yea, that happens when you guys bounce your window to 5am, then 3am, then back to 5am (EST). At first it wasn't a problem for me, I had baby leave. Now I'm back to work and can't make it, and IDK about the others. More of we just burned all of Phaeros's holdings… Moved on to sylva, then alot of stuff changed. Who know's maybe the burning will pick up soon.
 
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