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Whither Forever War?

Caldeathe Baequiannia
Decius
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Cheatle for TEO
See, I think the problem is that its no where near the sweet spot.

One side likes it how it is, and the other side wants changes. Until the polar ends are partially unsatisfied and the middle is fine, then we aren't where we should be.
My impression is that neither side likes it as it is, but one side is willing to work with what they have.
My impression is that there are far more than two sides, and by speaking as if they are we do a disservice to everyone including those people whose opinions we present.
I didn't want to criticize, but that was exactly my thinking.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Nihimon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Nihimon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
My impression is that neither side likes it as it is, but one side is willing to work with what they have.

One side is able to engage in their preferred playstyle with virtually no constraints. The other is subject to far more PvP than they were led to believe would be possible, while at the same time not having access to the systems that would have allowed them to win some respite by their own actions.
Maybe. Or maybe I was referring to Bandits, who have taken to harvesting bulk resources because they feel like they can't be bandits. Do you think Midnight and Bludd feel like they face no constraints?

Are you saying you weren't talking about the "two sides" in the "Forever War" which I expected to be the default subject of any posts with otherwise unclear antecedents in this thread?
Nihimon murmurs in sheer ecstasy as the magic courses through his veins
You are a Troll
Edam
For many of the members of my settlement, including quite a few that have left, PFO is the only game they play and in some cases the only MMO they have ever played.

True for me and my several friends who play.
Tyv Blodvaerd of Aragon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Nihimon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
My impression is that neither side likes it as it is, but one side is willing to work with what they have.

One side is able to engage in their preferred playstyle with virtually no constraints. The other is subject to far more PvP than they were led to believe would be possible, while at the same time not having access to the systems that would have allowed them to win some respite by their own actions.
Maybe. Or maybe I was referring to Bandits, who have taken to harvesting bulk resources because they feel like they can't be bandits. Do you think Midnight and Bludd feel like they face no constraints?

The contraints are present for the function of true banditry. Bandits should not have to feud a comoany, in order to raid their holdings. That is conceptually flawed. There are so many contraints on bandirty, that no one actually does it, it has been abandoned ever since the WoT ended the Hex is a FFA PvP zone.

PvP is completely flawed in every aspect and in every implementation GW has used to introduce it or attempt to deter it. Every system has failed becuase of out of sequence implementation, halfhearted backing of PvP in general and halfassed testing and forethought of the systems.

In any new iteration of PFO, I'm hoping that whole new, and much more simple systems are put in place. PvP should be an opt-in based system and have features and advantages attached to it that are semi exclusive to taking in the added risk. This way, if you have no interest in PvP, you don't have to… Ever. If all you want to do is PvP, there will be places for you to hunt for it and opponents for you to engage in. No need for reputation or influence, just the willingness to opt in.
Aragon (CN) a settlement founded on the principles of the River Freedoms: Say What You Will; Oath Breakers Die; Walk Any Road, Float Any River; Courts are for Kings; Slavery is an Abomination; Have What You Hold.

Settlement Focus: Fighter and Rogue Training
Game Play: Escalations / Refining / Crafting / Defensive PVP
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Nihimon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Nihimon
Caldeathe Baequiannia
My impression is that neither side likes it as it is, but one side is willing to work with what they have.

One side is able to engage in their preferred playstyle with virtually no constraints. The other is subject to far more PvP than they were led to believe would be possible, while at the same time not having access to the systems that would have allowed them to win some respite by their own actions.
Maybe. Or maybe I was referring to Bandits, who have taken to harvesting bulk resources because they feel like they can't be bandits. Do you think Midnight and Bludd feel like they face no constraints?

Are you saying you weren't talking about the "two sides" in the "Forever War" which I expected to be the default subject of any posts with otherwise unclear antecedents in this thread?
No. I'm saying that the notion that there are only two sides in the combat is flawed. Do you honestly feel that Doc and Midnight are "able to engage in their preferred playstyle with virtually no constraints?"
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Brighthaven Leader
I was specifically talking about Feud Mechanics and War, and the sub systems that have to do with that. I didn't mention banditry or anything else for that matter, because its a separate issue altogether.
Brighthaven is a Neutral Good settlement focused on defending its citizens and its allies from negative fringe based PvP (Player Killing and Griefing) while striving to become a large and shining beacon for Good. Whether you wish to benefit from this protection or you love PvP and wish to assist in providing this protection, Brighthaven aims to be the home and support center for you!
Yrme
Tyv Blodvaerd of Aragon
The contraints are present for the function of true banditry. Bandits should not have to feud a comoany, in order to raid their holdings. That is conceptually flawed. There are so many contraints on bandirty, that no one actually does it, it has been abandoned ever since the WoT ended the Hex is a FFA PvP zone.

I've lost cargo to various mixes of Flynn Pontis, Tigari, and Elsworth Sugarfoot on a few occasions, mostly before the EoX-EBA conflict ramped up. They took rep hits and gained loot. It seemed to work. They didn't seem to need FFA PvP zones.

I agree that we should be able to raid holdings or outposts without fueds. I'd offer that such raids should not be territorial wars, but simply criminal actions. Unfortunately this requires a criminal flag and/or alignment shift for criminal action; that's new work.
At some point, crowdforging suggestions seem to be like fan fiction. Some good, some bad, some repetitious and predictable. But maybe there are some gems out there.
tribuzio
Phyllain
Decius
N
So do you agree that jerking the window around like that shouldn't be possible, or not?

Nope, we know exactly when it is every day because we have the ability to check it.

Please try to use the quotes as appropriate, you have messed them up. I have removed the quotes without any text.
Bringslite
Lets get some things straight here because I think the conversation is finally turning toward a very important subject.

First, I want to make clear that my comments are not directed specifically at EoX as if EoX is the cause of any problem or a weight on this game by their actions. The fault here is, as Bluddwolf (and some others) keeps bringing up more diplomatically, the mechanics. EoX is using the mechanics. The focus should be on the mechanics.

*Right now there just aren't any limitations for all out PVP. It costs too little.

*There are barely any consequences for failing at attack. You can run a feud 23/7/365 just by rotating the companies that you feud every so often, IF there were cooldowns. Right now even the cooldowns do not work.

*There are zero respites for defeating any attack. Lets change "rewards" to "respites" because that is what we really mean by reward in this sense. There probably should be a lessening in strength or ability to continually press attack if you can be turned away or defeated enough.

Can't the costs be adjusted or the risk be increased?

The thing is that right now the population is very small and even if the staff is small, the fixes might not be that difficult. In fact, the fixes might be handled by simple direct Dev Moderation rather than automatic programs. I mean this in a TEMPORARY fashion. Not a permanent setup. I know the dream is to have Big Zog handle almost all of this stuff.

The above may be a ridiculous suggestion. I have never run an MMO, especially a critically understaffed MMO. Still, the fixes may be as simple as changing the costs. So far, GW in making tweaks, has gone the old school route of going from one extreme to the other when making adjustments. This is very common in MMOs for some reason. Most times it is in the Devs ability to hit a middle ground but historically we have seen MMO Devs overcorrect, more often than not. This causes even more problems.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Hobson Fiffledown
What if you could could bank Inf at a holding (say, equal to its current banked upkeep cost) to override rep-free combat in that hex for a period equal to basic feud length with the same 10% Inf loss at the end?

No company could protect 100% of their holdings 100% of the time, but you could get a little respite or at least concentrate your defenses more. I would still make the holdings in protected hexes vulnerable to capture, but it would mean a big rep hit. I would almost argue for a guard upgrade too. As higher plus holdings would cost more to keep protected, no group could protect themselves indefinitely.

The hex owner should have to bank the influence physically at the holding toolbox. It might add a little intelligence/CI to the game, attackers would have to scout more, and it might help out with some basic company issues (hopping, static inf holding companies, inf whales, etc.).

Faction based PvP would have to happen first though!
This space for rent.
 
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