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I would like to build a city

Ravenlute
Newbie: Hi, I heard this game was like Kingmaker. I want to build my own city.

Veteran: Awesome!

Newbie: How do I do that?

Veteran: You can't, all the spots are taken.

Newbie: What do you mean all the spots are taken?

Veteran: You can only build in certain spots and they have all been claimed.

Newbie: I can't just build anywhere I want?

Veteran: Nope.

Newbie: Well, I've got a bunch of friends that like PvP. We'll just destroy one so we can build our own.

Veteran: Sounds like fun.

Newbie: So are there siege engines or something? Or do I need to set a siege timer?

Veteran: Nope, no siege engines, timers or any of that because you can't take over or burn down somebody else's settlement yet.

Newbie: What the hell? How am I supposed to build a city then?

Veteran: You can join a settlement, rise in the ranks and take it over. Or buy one from another group for real money. Then you can make it your own.

Newbie: That's kind of messed up. So if I do that and get my own spot, then I can make a giant castle and surround it with spikes? Then put a jail in the middle to hold people for ransom so their friends have to come fight me to rescue them?

Veteran: Uh… no. You have to make or buy a building of the type you want and then you can put them in a predesignated slot.

Newbie: Is there a large castle? With spikes?

Veteran: There's a Keep but you can't go inside it. Has a spikey fence though!

Newbie: What's the point if you can't go inside? Isn't that the last bastion of defense?!

Veteran: You don't need to defend since settlements can't be attacked. It's a crafting station for the Seneschal.

Newbie: Can I go in any of the buildings?

Veteran: Yes! You can go in the Tavern. It has a fireplace, a bar and even a second level.

Newbie: What kind of drinks do they have?

Veteran: They don't, but you can do a /drink emote that gives a message in the chat box.

Newbie: …

Veteran: …

Newbie: I'm going to go play ARK. Let me know when I can build my own city.
Myl - Herald of Stone Bear Clan (Tavernhold)
"You can walk into Tavernhold but a horse will have to carry you out."
Midnight
Ravenlute
Newbie: I'm going to go play ARK. Let me know when I can build my own city.

Or at least when I can vandalize someone else's city by painting their buildings pink. ;-)

He who wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.
-Edmund Burke
Phyllain
These things are why so many ppl have left.
Tigari
eh, I was ok with the slow pace of settlement stuff. My problem was the pvp. They listened to one group who got mad about their win condition not mattering at the end of the day, even though Our win condition was still being met. (still don't understand why our win condition mattered any less then theirs :S)
Hobson Fiffledown
And now it's PvE or nothing. I had to lure people to come fight me for prizes…
This space for rent.
Bringslite
Tigari
eh, I was ok with the slow pace of settlement stuff. My problem was the pvp. They listened to one group who got mad about their win condition not mattering at the end of the day, even though Our win condition was still being met. (still don't understand why our win condition mattered any less then theirs :S)

I don't follow what you mean there. Feuds are nothing but punishing for either side now. At least they aren't just punishing for the defender only.

Is this system also screwy? Yes. I don't think GW would have changed anything if they did not also feel that the first iteration was unbalanced.

What does some "middle ground" look like to you guys that is fair and acceptable for aggressor AND defender?
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Schedim
Ravenlute, you really really hit the nail with that hammer!

Back at the KS time I was expecting a much more … pioneerish. And as it seems E11 is just spoonfeeding the current town into what they currently are anyway.

I would say, wipe everything and lets start build it up from the ground, it would certainly draw more people … Possibly many more than we would lose, as there isn't that many around…
Schedim: Peddler and dealer in stuff easily transported, restless wandering the land of the River. Trying to find out how to reawaken the cult of Hanspur. To realise this ambition I created the company named Rats of Hanspur.
You can reach me on: pfo.schedim@gmail.com
Tigari
Bringslite
Tigari
eh, I was ok with the slow pace of settlement stuff. My problem was the pvp. They listened to one group who got mad about their win condition not mattering at the end of the day, even though Our win condition was still being met. (still don't understand why our win condition mattered any less then theirs :S)

I don't follow what you mean there. Feuds are nothing but punishing for either side now. At least they aren't just punishing for the defender only.

Is this system also screwy? Yes. I don't think GW would have changed anything if they did not also feel that the first iteration was unbalanced.

What does some "middle ground" look like to you guys that is fair and acceptable for aggressor AND defender?

Fueds, IN MY OPINION, have NEVER been punishing to the defenders. I think actually the opposite, They were in favor of. For one, they got all the pvp opportunities of the Aggressor, PLUS they didn't have to spend the influence. THEY set when they want to pvp (for holdings). Nothing in this seems to be in disfavor to the defender. They win the fued, YAY They got to keep their holdings. If the defenders wanted more then to just keep their holdings, then THEY should have to spend the influence. A good defense is rewarded with maintaining their stuff , again IN MY OPINION. If they want MORE, they should go on the offensive.

Alot of the people in this game are BARELY accepting of pvp. I doubt their opinions and people like mine (a bit more hardcore pvp) will ever line up with what's fair or not, so finding a middle ground is a bit rought. And why should I find a middle ground? I can just find a new game with what I want.

I'm just gunna let the devs make the game they want, and if it suits me, awesome, I'll play, if not, I'll find a new game. This whole crowdforging thing has been pretty horrible, and has done nothing but make people "find a middle ground" in something they're paying for, for fun.
Bringslite
I suppose that is the catch, right? If the people concerned with these mechanics can be considered as two different sides for the issue, it is unlikely that middle ground can be found. We have all been over these things many times.

IMO, previously there was an imbalance detrimental to the defender. A +0 holding with two +3 outposts costs (I believe) 300 influence. Losing just one of those setups costs the defender 75 influence (still does). I just don't see how any defender could recover from that after a few losses.

^^^If my numbers are wrong, please point out how.^^^

You don't see that as unbalanced compared with the previous cost to start a feud. One of your companies was able to run multiple feuds fairly consistently. If Ozem's were powerful and aggressive, I don't imagine that I would like losing that power.

It is fair enough that you feel how you do about it and vote with your gaming time. smile I just wish that there was some medium acceptable middle ground. Odd (and I suppose normal) that no one recognizes what the other thinks is unfair and broken.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Phyllain
I think most of the disconnect on defenders getting something for defending is that the concept is just completly forign to most mmo pvpers. A defender gets to keep their stuff if they win. If they want something they can go attack.
 
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