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Holding Changes

Gagnrath
Keep crafting queues as they are - you can't be working on two different highly powerful weapons or armor at the same time. Just think how super valuable such creations (and the people who can create them) will become when more players enter the game!
Duffy Swiftshadow
What we do today is a pittance of what will be around tomorrow. Forcing something to be rarer or more difficult to benefit myself as a veteran is of no interest to me. Don't forget once things get going there is a strong chance resource costs are going to skyrocket to some new stabilization point, which means gear prices are going to follow suit, which means all that stockpiled money ain't gonna matter as much or will drive up prices. Granted it depends on the new supply and demand at that point in time. Right now demand is very very low and supply is high. If 500 people enter the game and start needing T2 in 2-3 weeks what will the supply and demand look like?

Based on things they've said and planned I think ideally T2 supply should be pretty reliable and T3 supply should have all the rarity. I think multiple queues actually makes that easier to balance than a single queue as you can worry less about cranking T3 crafting time up and the impact it has on T2 via opportunity cost. Plus having a reward for dedicated crafters that actually benefits their play-style will help making that high level crafting stuff attractive. Being able to craft some high level T3 thing is great and all, but monetarily speaking it won't be much different than crafting 10 T2 items. They need a reward for dedication that benefits their activities just like combat classes get for upping their role levels.
Bringslite
@ Duffy

Your whole argument is based around the premise that, though supply far outweighs demand right now, there will be a complete reversal due to a severely radical change from a crafter heavy pop to a crafter light pop.

At least one guy that I play with here thinks the same. I disagree. I think that there will be plenty of crafters.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Stilachio Thrax
Bringslite
@ Duffy

Your whole argument is based around the premise that, though supply far outweighs demand right now, there will be a complete reversal due to a severely radical change from a crafter heavy pop to a crafter light pop.

At least one guy that I play with here thinks the same. I disagree. I think that there will be plenty of crafters.

I agree, BL. I have yet to play an MMO- sandbox or themepark- that didn't have a ton of crafters and a constant, steady supply of crafted gear. Even to top of the line rare crafted gear and materials could be reliably found through auction or trade (perhaps costly for a newer player, but certainly within reach of anyone playing consistently for a while. I would expect that any increase of population would bring a surge of newer crafters that will quickly plug production gaps for T2 gear allowing the vet crafters continue to push out T3 gear.
Virtus et Honor

Steward of Ozem's Vigil, Lord Commander of the Argyraspides Iomedais
Smitty
Folks are constantly saying this game needs more pathfinder type rules in PFO .

So My vote would be no to being able to fill multiple crafting ques..

Then again my vote is anyone in the right tier regardless of which ability score is up to that tier level should be able to drink a potion. And that is not the case ..

Duffy Swiftshadow
Well let's try this:

If you believe there will be so many crafters that supply will/should reliably outstrip demand, then why does an extra queue matter? It would be a superfluous perk for crafters.

But if the extra queue matters, then it means the only way to meet demand or get closer to meeting it requires the extra queue. Thus the queue is beneficial and not imbalanced if you believe supply will/should generally meet and surpass demand.

The queue is only an imbalance if you believe supply should never outstrip demand and the extra queue allows the supply to do so. Additionally that belief also implies that creating a new character and paying cash for the queue is a better condition for boosting crafting than having an extra one attainable in game under some conditions.

Personally the only other sandbox I've played significantly with a comparable crafting system is EVE and their crafting allowed multiple crafting jobs at a time, albeit they took up a limited number of slots at the crafting facility. I think that last restriction has since been lifted and replaced with some sort of efficiency multiplier.

Edit:
This example kinda of begs a question: if supply ends up drastically outstripping demand as a general rule is that bad? Should something be done to adjust that? How should adjustments be made and to what aspects?
Bringslite
When I say that I believe that there will be more crafters than some seem to think, I don't mean that there will be too many. Not going to firmly predict enough-too many-too few, cause that isn't provable in any way ATM. I FEEL like, and so BELIEVE, there will be an adequate percent of crafters to non.
#1. Gather/Craft people like sandboxes, especially where all gear is player crafted. It is a feature that draws players.
#2. Taking Gather/Craft skills is the best bang for your xp buck(excluding features) in building up ability scores. As noted before- There are always exceptions, but most new players do not feel they are "valuable"(despite assurance) until their skills are up and craft dipping is quickest.

The worst case that I can think of is excess supply. Excess demand is usually looked upon as an economy grower though it can cause problems if it is around too long. Number of Queues, crafting time, realistic accounts of supply and demand can all be looked at when the time comes and adjusted then. Right now supply is WAY too much vs demand, except possibly in T3 armors.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Caldeathe Baequiannia
TLDR: From what I can see, there are no non-selfish reasons for increasing the production capacity of individual toons.

If they don't add extra queue time, people who want more will complain. If they do, it lessens the need for more crafters and makes it more difficult for new people who are interested in crafting to make it worth their while. With no shortage of goods in the economy at the moment, the only people who benefit from more queue times are crafters who want do control more of the flow of goods by increasing their ability to satisfy the demand, and therefore increase their share of the market. There are lots of crafters who do not have full queues, and lots of characters that could be crafting but don't because they don't need to.

If they don't add more queue time, and it turns out to be needed, they can do so at any time. If they do add more crafting time, and it turns out to have been a mistake, people will complain more bitterly about losing something they already had than they are currently complaining about wanting it. I haven't seen anything presented that makes a good-for-the-economy-and-playerbase case for crafters being able to produce more. A time might come when it is needed, but it isn't now.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Bringslite
@ Caldeathe Baequiannia

JINX!
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Azure_Zero
Let's get back on Topic of Holding changes, Not Crafting Queues.

If you wish to continue it, put it in its own thread.
 
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