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Holding Changes

Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
That's going to happen anyways
Yes it is. And the opposite side of the P2W transaction is that if people are going to do it anyway, we should at least make them pay for it. giving people two queues does nothing to make anybody pay for it.

Who cares if they are paying for it if the in-game effect is the same and negative? Is that gonna make new single character crafter joe blow any better off?
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
That's going to happen anyways
Yes it is. And the opposite side of the P2W transaction is that if people are going to do it anyway, we should at least make them pay for it. giving people two queues does nothing to make anybody pay for it.

Who cares if they are paying for it if the in-game effect is the same and negative? Is that gonna make new single character crafter joe blow any better off?
I'm not the one who said we can't stop it.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
I'm not the one who said we can't stop it.

Elaborate? I don't understand what your trying to say with that.
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
I'm not the one who said we can't stop it.

Elaborate? I don't understand what your trying to say with that.
You said we can't stop people from doing it. I said if they're going to do it, the least we can do is make them pay to do it. If you want your crafters to have two queues, get another account, and use your excess supply of recipes to kit it out. Giving crafters a second queue just lets you make more at no opportunity cost whatsoever.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
Caldeathe Baequiannia
I'm not the one who said we can't stop it.

Elaborate? I don't understand what your trying to say with that.
You said we can't stop people from doing it. I said if they're going to do it, the least we can do is make them pay to do it. If you want your crafters to have two queues, get another account, and use your excess supply of recipes to kit it out. Giving crafters a second queue just lets you make more at no opportunity cost whatsoever.

That argument boils down to it's okay to break the economy (assuming it would) as long as you pay a little bit of cash for it?
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
That argument boils down to it's okay to break the economy (assuming it would) as long as you pay a little bit of cash for it?
that's B.S. Again, you are the one who said people are going to do it anyway. I'm saying that the fact people are going do it anyway is not a reason to make it easier.
To reach me, email d20rpg@gmail.com
Paddy Fitzpatrick
Ya know, considering that my guys are looking to try to buy some older accounts too just to keep up with stuff and stsy competitive, the P2W is real.

The problem is there aint no in game way to get a reward lile that for all the hard earned troubles. Ya cant catch a break and until this game relaunches the harsh reality is any active player in your group has gotta have multiple accounts to just atay afloat.

Then on top of that cause of the paasive xp, the way to win is buy accounts for hundreds of dollars that got a bunch of unspent xp. Now in a game like EVE where you can do a lot of different roles and it aint a linesr progression this isnt nearly as big a problem. There are also lots more people in a big world with lots more factions.

This game has a linear progression, not nearly as much diveristy in roles or within eqch role, AND there arent that many players or player factions. One guy who has thousands of dollars, forty accounts, and enough time on their hands can throw this whole syatem out of whack. That one person woth all those crafting queues can make a huge spalshdown. Now it has become an arms race, and he who has the most phat stacks wins.

At least make it so people who dont wanna pay more than you would for a warhammer army (yeah, when something approaches warhammer spending, yoy got a problem) can stay competitive. Throw the average joes a bone here, dont encourage the rise of a P2W aristocracy.
Paddy Fitzpatrick - Rí Ruírec of Fianna, roaming bands of noble warriors!
Member of Aragon Alliance and home of bandits, privateers, and anyone looking to get away from the shackles of law.
Find us on PFO Discord
Paddy Fitzpatrick
Caldeathe Baequiannia
Duffy Swiftshadow
That argument boils down to it's okay to break the economy (assuming it would) as long as you pay a little bit of cash for it?
that's B.S. Again, you are the one who said people are going to do it anyway. I'm saying that the fact people are going do it anyway is not a reason to make it easier.
When warhammer level spending becomes not just the norm but the basic minimum level requirement just to keep up with the pack, you got a major problem.

It is called what happened in thr MMO Archeage. Making it more expensive by itself aint gonna stop the P2W dudes with the phat stacks, it just makes everyone else who already has to break their bank account to keep up completely unable to do so. Then you get the p2w aristocracy that will always be light years ahead of people who dont want to spend warhammer levels of money on it (or would just realize that a warhammer army would be a better use of said spending anyway).

Thr only way to solve it is to give the people who want to only pay a sane amount of money some in gsme way to keep up.
Paddy Fitzpatrick - Rí Ruírec of Fianna, roaming bands of noble warriors!
Member of Aragon Alliance and home of bandits, privateers, and anyone looking to get away from the shackles of law.
Find us on PFO Discord
Edam
In perspective …

My understanding is that the original reason Ryan et al proposed multiple queues was that after a few years (probably a bit over two years but I am too lazy to do the math) a pure crafter will have maxed out its Primary and Secondary craft at level 20 and maxed out the relevant freeholder feats. At that point with a single queue there is nothing useful left to train. Multiple queues open the option to train a third or fourth craft and have it actually useful.

Multiple queues appear designed to solve a problem that will not occur for several years yet and will only be an issue for dedicated crafters who eventually run out of useful feats to train.

There is no reason at all for multiple queues now, or at any time in the near future. however LONGTERM if we drop the multiple queues proposal we will need to create something else useful for dedicated crafters to train once they have maxed their two main craft/refine abilities and relevant freeholder feats.
Bringslite
The P2W argument is coming out here? For that argument to have a valid basis it really has to be on a one type of account vs one same type of account basis. Otherwise, it is ALL P2W EVERYWHERE.

Look guys, as a dedication perk for crafters that achieve high ranks, it doesn't look so bad. That is a somewhat controlled addition of more production power. Seems like it will be a major advantage to the older more established groups and I am not sure that is a great thing for new people coming into the game. I don't think that it will make playing a crafter more exciting or enjoyable in and of itself, though.

The above is much different than ALL crafters having an easy path(through a feat or a building) to multiple queues. If Joe is already playing and starts another account to craft, while that is an advantage for Joe, it isn't really much different than a new person coming into the game and taking up crafting. The only way to never allow any advantage obtained through $$$ with multiple accounts is to not allow it. That ship sailed before any of us logged in the first time.

Now if no one was suggesting that ALL crafters should have a relatively easy way to obtain multiple simultaneous queues, then obviously I am barking for no reason. :0 "Wuff!"
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
 
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