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Thank You Lisa, for Hope and the Road Map.

Duffy Swiftshadow
Bringslite of Staalgard
There is an itch in the back of my mind that still tells me that the potential PVP oriented customers will be wanting some form of loot possible involved in the PVP thing. It adds a bit to the excitement. Though even if gear dropped, it may not be the stuff that the victor wants and it would be a hassle to sell since it comes damaged…

Somewhat, but the catch is what type of PvP. In a pitched territory fight that's close to even almost everyone is gonna die, so looting just to get killed yourself and lose the loot doesn't end up very rewarding, the reward is really the territory. In a clear short battle going straight to a rout a side could get some loot, but again that's most likely the blob doing what it does best than a realistic scenario. But in something more akin to ganking/banditry loot is the desired goal and that is not filled right now.

Midnight
Threading (actually the limitations of threading) would send losers home faster, rather than have them keep returning to the battle. That may or may not be viewed as an improvement.

Only if threading guarantees loss of armor or weapons from one or a few deaths, which means it's impossible to ever be 'safely' threaded. If that was true then I think it's more likely that in any sort of 'pitched' group battle folks will minimize their gear loss from threading because if your enemy doesn't and you can remove their critical piece of gear by killing them once or a few times, you now have a huge advantage. It doesn't really solve the problems, it moves them around and changes some of the meta but I think the core problem is still there, it just speeds up getting to the result.
Flari-Merchant
In a successful picture of this game(one with a player base), I see the most common type of PVP needing to be the ganking/banditry/resource-interdiction type. With loot. The Holding type stuff is simply not rewarding enough for "Everyday Joe" to find satisfying.
If somehow the Holding capture the flag game can be made immediately rewarding or somehow strongly incentivized by power gain, the above won't matter as much.
Meaningful PVP will still need to be rewarding for victors on all levels.
The Eternal Balance
Bringslite of Staalgard
In a successful picture of this game(one with a player base), I see the most common type of PVP needing to be the ganking/banditry/resource-interdiction type. With loot. The Holding type stuff is simply not rewarding enough for "Everyday Joe" to find satisfying.
If somehow the Holding capture the flag game can be made immediately rewarding or somehow strongly incentivized by power gain, the above won't matter as much.
Meaningful PVP will still need to be rewarding for victors on all levels.

PVP over gushers?
It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.
Flari-Merchant
The Eternal Balance
Bringslite of Staalgard
In a successful picture of this game(one with a player base), I see the most common type of PVP needing to be the ganking/banditry/resource-interdiction type. With loot. The Holding type stuff is simply not rewarding enough for "Everyday Joe" to find satisfying.
If somehow the Holding capture the flag game can be made immediately rewarding or somehow strongly incentivized by power gain, the above won't matter as much.
Meaningful PVP will still need to be rewarding for victors on all levels.

PVP over gushers?
Good point. That will help.
Duffy Swiftshadow
Good point on gushers, they can make a much more interesting PvP scenario than what we've seen so far. Something like caravans restricted to roads would help with that too, though I'm pretty sure that's super far outside scope. Those types of encounters has very tangible potential for risk/reward via PvP.

…or maybe assassinations…smile
Bob
Threading was discussed, but was pretty complicated and didn't really hit the goals Lisa spelled out as well as the tasks that did make it into the roadmap. Definitely something we'd like to revisit at some point.
Gross
As one who doesn't normally pay any attention to PVP related forum comments due to wandering the world with only good intent towards others, what is 'Threading'?
Mercenary monster hunter from Forgeholm
War priest of Angradd… patiently waiting on Goblinworks to deliver him (and greataxes, Dwarves need 2 handed axes).
Bob
Gross
As one who doesn't normally pay any attention to PVP related forum comments due to wandering the world with only good intent towards others, what is 'Threading'?

Basically, you'd be able to designate some of your equipped gear as "threaded," and anything that isn't threaded would fall off as loot when you die. Better gear would generally require more threads, so there'd be limits to how much cool stuff you can wear at once without risking significant losses. It would also make it more likely that someone who killed you would get something significant in the resulting loot.
Tyncale
Bob
Gross
As one who doesn't normally pay any attention to PVP related forum comments due to wandering the world with only good intent towards others, what is 'Threading'?

Basically, you'd be able to designate some of your equipped gear as "threaded," and anything that isn't threaded would fall off as loot when you die. Better gear would generally require more threads, so there'd be limits to how much cool stuff you can wear at once without risking significant losses. It would also make it more likely that someone who killed you would get something significant in the resulting loot.
In my opinion, the intended effects of Threading will only truly kick in when *all* slots of the Paper Doll have become useful. I.e. when Enchanting has been implemented and Utilities have been made useful. Only then will players start to make decisions wether to thread just their Armor and/or Weaponslot and leave the rest unprotected, or maybe wield a somewhat lesser weapon and use their allotment of threads to protect some of their Enchanted Gear that is used for a Utility that they deem crucial.

Right now, everybody will simply use all threads they can muster to protect their Weapon and Armor. I understand that threading your Armor or Weaponslot will pretty much take up all your threads (leaving Trophees and such vulnerable) but the balance currently is too focussed on the importance of your Weapon and Armor, so not many meaningful decisions to be made here.

I guess you could see the choice between Armor or Weapon as meaningfull though. smile I guess Threading will be a feature that will undergo many, many balancing checks anyway but it seems to me that the real balancing can only start after Enchanting is in.

I realize I am not offering a solution for PvP loot. smile
Regalo Harnoncourt, Leader of the River Kingdoms Trading Company, High Council of Callambea.
This is the character that I am playing almost 100% of the time. (Tyncale is my Sage/Mage)
Flari-Merchant
Personally I am fine with a world in which most of the fighting would be about territory control without immediate tangible rewards. Some of the fighting is about interdicting "poachers" of territorial resources with some "possible" tangible immediate rewards. Finally, the occasional robber or bandit that snags me and gets something I happen to be carrying(an extreme case). I'm not sure that will be as attractive to the larger Niche crowd desired and with PVP I set myself as "Niche within Niche" or occasional PVP no more than once per week on average is plenty for me.

Gushers stealing and raiding of Holdings for Bulk resources, I feel, is going to fix much of this for those more into PVP. Raw materials for gear are always nice and Bulk will become much more valuable in the coming updates. Maybe this is a non issue. Rereading the Road Map offers quite a bit of change on the horizon. It isn't easy to take in all at once.
 
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