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Before the Tens of Thousands.

Bob
Tyncale
Looks like there are more drawbacks to having interns currently then advantages. But definately a good thing to bring up. My son is in his first year of Informatics at the University, and though he is learning stuff in a fast pace, I can see how much guidance he would require in a professional team. smile

Bob, I wanted to ask something about using more assets in the game, like Plants, Flowers and Trees. Are you committed to only create and use true-to-Pathfinder assets for structures, Flora and Fauna? Or would it be possible to use more off-the-shelf Unity assets for Flora, for instance?

I understand that you only want true Pathfinder creatures in the game, like the great looking Goblins. I also believe that the structures we see have been created according to Pathfinder standards, though I have to say I see a lot of similarities in overall look when comparing to the structures in Shroud of the Avatar, another Unity game. Must be the coloring or texturing mostly.

Are you guys restricted for Flora in this regard too? I ask this because I think the world could greatly benefit by adding much more diversity and color! to the different regions in the world. Or would using standard Unity Flora Assets be too expensive anyway at the moment? Would they need a lot of expensive adaptation before they could be used in the world? I read something on the Shroud of the Avatar forums, how much work there still was involved in preparing an off-the-shelf Statue of a Horse (created by someone else) for use in that game.

Is this the same for a simple Cherry tree? Or for instance rows of Lettuce in one of the Cropland hexes?

We actually do already have some licensed assets in the game, but we usually have to tweak it a bit to get it to look right next to our existing assets. We do that whenever we think we can get to our desired final result more efficiently than starting from scratch, but the exact amount of tweaking required varies widely. We have no problem adding additional licensed assets, but even if we found stuff that fit in well without any tweaking (and you probably don't want me doing any of that kind of tweaking), it's still a fair amount of work just to get things imported and then distribute them appropriately throughout the world. That means it's the usual prioritization exercise for us to decide what we're best off spending our time on, and that usually means we're best off focusing on things more closely related to other things Cole and I have been tackling over the past couple years. Things like this are probably best tackled when we're either running low on promising things to do, or when we're able to add someone who can really focus on more art-related tasks.
Bob
Tyncale
Biome, I was looking for that word, thank you. smile About the effort involved, I have seen youtubes where I see a guy "prettying up" a Unity landscape in real time, before my very eyes, in minutes. We may have to take that with a grain of salt though.

I agree that the sheer amount of Hexes is a problem. smile Still, buy 7 types of Crops from the Unity shelf, let us say Lettuce, Corn, Wheat, Strawberries, Melons, Zuccini, Sunflowers, then plop these down on 80 Cropland hexes in a somewhat believable fashion.

Do you have to place these one at a time? Can you "paint" a surface with these, like I have seen people paint entire Mountain ranges in youtubes? Would this bog down framerate? Can the engine handle this? I am curious about all these things.

I am pretty sure the roads in PFO are also painted on, looking at the rather silly way they sometimes follow the landscape. So this stuff is possible in Unity. I agree that "tidying up" all the odd bits is a huge amount of work, but that can be done later.

It is in fact closer to "painting" large areas than to placing individual plants, and a lot of that painting is actually done using various algorithms so we don't have to do it by hand. Even then, the world is huge, and we tend to have to load it up in small chunks that each take a long time to process, and we often have to manipulate the algorithms or special-case certain areas to fix various problems. It's also done at a pretty early stage of a very complex terrain import process, which is why I've stuck to fixes that I can do on the already-imported terrain. Then I have to file bug reports to duplicate each of those fixes the next time we do a pass on the actual terrain assets, because otherwise all those fixes will get overridden by the next import. As a result, we're pretty limited on what we can do for now.

And yes, there are probably some performance considerations in regard to increasing the number of textures we're using. We can use various tricks to manage that, such as making sure that you can only see so many different plants from any one location, but that requires more care and time to get right.
Tyncale
Thanks Bob, obviously a lot of work is involved, I was afraid of that. I understand that it is low on the list. Or not at all currently. I hope that at some point you guys can hire a few more people and I think one of them should be a dedicated Worldbuilder. smile
Regalo Harnoncourt, Leader of the River Kingdoms Trading Company, High Council of Callambea.
This is the character that I am playing almost 100% of the time. (Tyncale is my Sage/Mage)
Flari-Merchant
One more thing to suggest for the Time of the ToTs: World Bosses or similar random and scheduled events.
"I buy Azoth for 5sp/ea. I will trade Enchanting or other rare materials/anything for Azoth. Contact me if interested. GET YOUR COIN EASY!"
uotopia@msn.com
Wolf of Rathglen
There's no search feature in these forums, can someone bring me up on what the Time of Ten Thousands is?
Hammerfall: Like a waterfall, but tougher.
Bob
Bringslite of Staalgard
One more thing to suggest for the Time of the ToTs: World Bosses or similar random and scheduled events.

That's something we've always planned, but would involve a fair amount of work. Just have to see when we can fit it into the schedule.
Bob
Wolf of Rathglen
There's no search feature in these forums, can someone bring me up on what the Time of Ten Thousands is?

Just a variant of the terminology introduced by the original post in this thread. Check there for more info.
Wolf of Rathglen
That was the post that made me think the term represented something specific that I couldn't find information on. Good to have it sorted. Thanks again.
Hammerfall: Like a waterfall, but tougher.
Tyncale
Wolf of Rathglen
That was the post that made me think the term represented something specific that I couldn't find information on. Good to have it sorted. Thanks again.
I made that post and it indeed does refer to something more specific; I did not make that up out of thin air. smile

It is Lisa herself that mentioned these Tens of Thousands in this quote:

Of course, finishing out the feature set is only one half of the equation. We need quite a few more people playing the game for all of this to work. Thankfully, I have various marketing efforts planned that will bring in tens of thousands of people to try out the game. I just need to make sure that when I kick those plans into effect, that the game is to a point where they will have the best chance of sticking and becoming regular players. We aren’t at that point yet and it may take a half year or more before I am ready to bring a lot more players. But I wanted you to know that it will be coming as part of this takeover of the game by Paizo.

You can find the blog post here: https://goblinworks.com/blog/the-road-forward/

I took that quote and used Caps to make it resemble the titles of the legendary Blogs of Ryan Dancey. smile It may look as if I am using Lisa's quote in a sarcastic manner but in fact I find it a very important part of her Blog post. Ryan himself had been playing with the idea of Greenlighting PFO on Steam at some point but it never came to that. Yet. I can only think that this is what Lisa is referring to. We already have tried the free Trials, and the Tabletop Paizo Crowd already has been tapped (and utterly disillusioned, I think) when the original Kickstarters hit. (At least I hope she is not referring to the Paizo crowd. I guess she could easily send out a "gift" to all the registered Paizo folks for a PFO trial with maybe a few months of xp, but I think that is totally the wrong crowd.)

I have always been an advocate for throwing this game in front of the Steam crowd. The big question is, when? There may never be a good time, since the Steam Crowd will rip any game apart anyway, but obviously PFO just has too many things going against it right now, the subscription model being one. Still, it is something I am looking forward to.

That is why I made that post, because I want to give that crowd the least possible reason to complain about bullshit.

Complaining about the subscriptionmodel: fine. I can defend that. We can defend that. Or at least discuss it.
Complaining about the graphics: fine. We can discuss that.
Complaining about not being able to scroll in every window after 3 years of development; not fine, can't really defend nor discuss that.

So that is the real reason behind my creating the "ToT" Tens of Thousands. I am not being facetitious, I think this could actually be an exiting thing to happen.

Edit: I like your twist on it, Time of Ten Thousands. smile
Edit: I linked to Lisas blog post in the OP.

Disclaimer: me thinking the ToT is the Greenlight Steam Crowd is total conjecture on my part!! Could be totally something else.
Regalo Harnoncourt, Leader of the River Kingdoms Trading Company, High Council of Callambea.
This is the character that I am playing almost 100% of the time. (Tyncale is my Sage/Mage)
You are a Troll
Tyncale
Disclaimer: me thinking the ToT is the Greenlight Steam Crowd is total conjecture on my part!! Could be totally something else.

Especially since Steam GreenLight is now dead?
 
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