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Ammo

Giorgio
OK, I need some clarification (as a math challenged human) on what Bob & the spreadsheets are saying, as regards to the tiers of the Monster Escalations and the ammo to use to kill them, is non-math terms.

Working on the principle you want to use cheap ammo on low level mobs (White/Yellow) and good ammo on high level mobs (Red/Purple) on a standard escalation (no special events). For this post, I am focusing on a dedicated archer as part of a group effort to clear a monster escalation (vs. casual play or for making a profit).

For example; which Monster Escalations would you match the following ammo type to:

Tier 1 escalations:
Ammo T1/+0
Ammo T1/+1
Ammo T1/+2
Ammo T1/+3

Tier 2 escalations:
Ammo T2/+0
Ammo T2/+1
Ammo T2/+2
Ammo T2/+3

Tier 3 escalations:
Ammo T3/+0
Ammo T3/+1
Ammo T3/+2
Ammo T3/+3

I know that the numbers are on the spreadsheet and in the release notes, but I don't understand what they mean in actual game play (as to what arrows to buy, what to equip, when to equip… ) .
First Elder Durin Steelforge; Leader of Forgeholm; Founder of Steelforge Engineering Company

PM Giorgo on Paizo Forums
PM Admin George on Commonwealth of the Free Highlands
Bringslite
Giorgio
OK, I need some clarification (as a math challenged human) on what Bob & the spreadsheets are saying, as regards to the tiers of the Monster Escalations and the ammo to use to kill them, is non-math terms.

Working on the principle you want to use cheap ammo on low level mobs (White/Yellow) and good ammo on high level mobs (Red/Purple) on a standard escalation (no special events). For this post, I am focusing on a dedicated archer as part of a group effort to clear a monster escalation (vs. casual play or for making a profit).

For example; which Monster Escalations would you match the following ammo type to:

Tier 1 escalations:
Ammo T1/+0
Ammo T1/+1
Ammo T1/+2
Ammo T1/+3

Tier 2 escalations:
Ammo T2/+0
Ammo T2/+1
Ammo T2/+2
Ammo T2/+3

Tier 3 escalations:
Ammo T3/+0
Ammo T3/+1
Ammo T3/+2
Ammo T3/+3

I know that the numbers are on the spreadsheet and in the release notes, but I don't understand what they mean in actual game play (as to what arrows to buy, what to equip, when to equip… ) .

I suggest:

Experiment with each different type of ammunition vs one type of mob. Note your results. Find the least expensive ammunition that gives you the bang you feel is adequate. And realize that the types will change as your bow skills advance.

There is no real way for anyone to answer this, better than what has already been written, other than your own observations. Far too many variables for anyone(so far) to want to tackle a 4D spreadsheet that it would take to figure out.
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Bringslite
Here is a very general idea (as far as I understand things anyway):

*For low level characters, scavenged ammo is "ok" and possibly equal to effect as damage from before ammunition.

*As your character grows and you have higher ranged attack bonus, more buffs, debuffs and conditionals for fighting with; ANY kind of ammo is going to be a little better than it was before all those bonuses.

*We have to figure out the "sweet spot" (at any point of our growth) for any ammo vs any kind of mob.

*You just want to make sure that you are not using ammo that is costing you more than the loot that you are getting from the mobs.

As you can imagine, unless we are playing your character with all of your specific modifiers, it would be pretty tough to tell YOU what ammo is best for what types/lvl mobs specifically.

@ Bob,
Is there a hard cap on how much "+ Base Damage" that a character can bring to bear on an attack?
Virtute et Armis
-Unknown
Bob
Bringslite
Is there a hard cap on how much "+ Base Damage" that a character can bring to bear on an attack?

I don't believe so.
Bob
Giorgio
Working on the principle you want to use cheap ammo on low level mobs (White/Yellow) and good ammo on high level mobs (Red/Purple) on a standard escalation (no special events).

As a general rule, you probably want to stick to cheaper ammo when you can, regardless of how tough the mobs are. Anything past T1 +1 ammo will usually cut into your profitability, meaning you'd be better off pursuing some other mobs that you can handle with cheaper ammo.

However, if you have a big reason to clear out an escalation that's a bit beyond what your party can handle with cheap ammo, or if you just need to clear something out more quickly than usual, then the extra expense of better ammo is probably worth it. How much better depends on how important it is to you to clear things out more quickly, or how much is necessary to get your party powerful enough to avoid excessive deaths. Two different parties facing the same mobs wouldn't necessarily want the same quality of ammo to hit that mark.
Giorgio
BL and Bob,

I have read this whole thread but I am still not closer to understanding what I actually need to buy (since I cant craft the items myself). Let me try rephrasing my questions above.

With a Longbow +2 and Rank 4 in all Longbow attacks, what arrows match the requirements below.

Standard Monster Hexes:
Note: Standard cost vs. profit calculations use above

T1/Soloing
T2/Soloing

T1/Normal Group Escalations
T2/Normal Group Escalations
T3/Normal Group Escalations

Holiday 2017 Escalating Escalation Event
Note: Damn the cost; I want the best money can buy!
There is a competition and I want my Fighter Archers to punch way above their weight.

T1/Time-Limited Group Escalation
T2/Time-Limited Group Escalation
T3/Time-Limited Group Escalation
First Elder Durin Steelforge; Leader of Forgeholm; Founder of Steelforge Engineering Company

PM Giorgo on Paizo Forums
PM Admin George on Commonwealth of the Free Highlands
WxCougar of KOTC
My observations with no math involved as a shortbow user with level 6 attacks and T3 bow - I have been doing fine (the same that I was pre-ammo) with just using salvaged ammo. It's definitely fine for all the low end stuff - and I've also worked on Ustalavs, Elementals and elite duergar with them. I've only done loners on the Gathering of Legends and am still using salvaged ammo. I've actually not tried using T1 +0 or any other plus ammo yet, but I might pull that out further along in the gathering and likely when we get to the Crown escalation.

Also of note: I am mixing up my attacks with dagger attacks too so I'm not a pure archer character. I am a scout/cut-throat rogue type. I also have not tried to do anything alone either - usually go out with at least one other player.
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Flari-Merchant
WxCougar of KOTC
My observations with no math involved as a shortbow user with level 6 attacks and T3 bow - I have been doing fine (the same that I was pre-ammo) with just using salvaged ammo. It's definitely fine for all the low end stuff - and I've also worked on Ustalavs, Elementals and elite duergar with them. I've only done loners on the Gathering of Legends and am still using salvaged ammo. I've actually not tried using T1 +0 or any other plus ammo yet, but I might pull that out further along in the gathering and likely when we get to the Crown escalation.

Also of note: I am mixing up my attacks with dagger attacks too so I'm not a pure archer character. I am a scout/cut-throat rogue type. I also have not tried to do anything alone either - usually go out with at least one other player.
Well said and excellent back up, WXCougar. smile
"I buy Azoth for 5sp/ea. I will trade Enchanting or other rare materials/anything for Azoth. Contact me if interested. GET YOUR COIN EASY!"
uotopia@msn.com
Flari-Merchant
Giorgio
BL and Bob,

I have read this whole thread but I am still not closer to understanding what I actually need to buy (since I cant craft the items myself). Let me try rephrasing my questions above.

With a Longbow +2 and Rank 4 in all Longbow attacks, what arrows match the requirements below.

Standard Monster Hexes:
Note: Standard cost vs. profit calculations use above

T1/Soloing
T2/Soloing

T1/Normal Group Escalations
T2/Normal Group Escalations
T3/Normal Group Escalations

Holiday 2017 Escalating Escalation Event
Note: Damn the cost; I want the best money can buy!
There is a competition and I want my Fighter Archers to punch way above their weight.

T1/Time-Limited Group Escalation
T2/Time-Limited Group Escalation
T3/Time-Limited Group Escalation
Until you have T3 attacks, you can't use T3 arrows.
So, if it is damn the cost situation then use T2 +3 arrows.
If it isn't then tell us how much coin you want to lose in any given situation. That's what it really IS ALL ABOUT! smile
"I buy Azoth for 5sp/ea. I will trade Enchanting or other rare materials/anything for Azoth. Contact me if interested. GET YOUR COIN EASY!"
uotopia@msn.com
Flari-Merchant
@ Giorio

I skipped this: There really isn't a standard cost vs profit calculation. Everybody has different bonuses, buffs, etc.. and no one has charted all of that out yet. Just know that anything you pay for arrows will cost more than a 100% melee character has to pay.

Further back in the thread, I noted down that against Duergar with T2 ammunition, I lost coin. With T1 or maybe Salvage(which I value at 1c/per), I made more coin than I spent…
"I buy Azoth for 5sp/ea. I will trade Enchanting or other rare materials/anything for Azoth. Contact me if interested. GET YOUR COIN EASY!"
uotopia@msn.com
 
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