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All posts created by Flari-Merchant

Come to think of it…. No we couldn't exactly do the same, "six window special", with workarounds. At least as far as actual Sieges are concerned, IF a settlement could only be sieged by ONE settlement at a time.
If you consider the ability of multiple settlements/organizations joining to siege a single city to be a blatant game imbalance that can horribly backfire, then yea, I'm OK with that. Bob is absolutely correct that even in our current state, that can be achieved, it's just a little more annoying - not nearly to the level that any groups interested in such teaming up would reconsider doing so because of it. I agree with Duffy that the ability to infinitely feud pretty easily is an issue, and it seems to me that we could think of a relatively easy-to-implement solution. That solution could be as simple as a bob-policy to not feud longer than, say, a week, with a week off, or something.
That is nicely constructive. I like it. Not sure that it would work that way in a large pop game, but we are all pretty cool here in this one.

@ Bob
What do you say to considering some hot fixes along those lines, Sir Bob? On the gang-up siege thing, have you considered the possibility(as mentioned above) of 6 different PVP windows that defenders would need to juggle during a siege? Or about the fact that defenders would only have the option of attacking one siege camp during each? Pretty easy for a partnership/alliance to defend(with 6 groups to draw from) their siege camps. Sorry if you addressed this. I am working on little sleep this week. smile
P.S. And I know that with how things are currently, that we could do something similar with workarounds anyhoo, but it still seems a terrible advantage.
Thank you for the feedback to the feedback. Honestly, I feel bad for you having to do things this way and in this order because it is simply something that you feel CAN be done to progress things. I hope that it doesn't turn out to be much effort for a few corner cases. Even your responses make it look like that is the motivation.

We put a lot of pressure on you guys. It is because we are losing hope. Yes even the diehard fanatics can run out of hope. Though we have lasted far longer than most, there are eventual limits. smile

I can see what you are doing here is going to be done, "come hell or high water", so I will take a break from ranting for awhile and see what you come up with. I am interested in seeing what checks and balances you come up with to help with the various ways that we will make this feature "unfun" for each other.
Honestly bob, I think high-end holdings are strong enough as-is. Yes, we took a +4 watchtower using superior strategy, but I can already imagine how difficult it would have been to take it otherwise. That's a good balancing point - we needed superior strategy in addition to a numbers advantage to take it "easily". I strongly suspect a +5 would all but be insurmountable given current server population, even with superior strategy.
I should never have couched my point with an opinion that could be debated. smile
Nevertheless, I will stand on "at their upkeep cost, they are not worth the trouble".
The Gathering Bonanza was a very good move and a stunning success, in relative measurements, because of a very key factor that is at the very heart of player psychology: Reward. Direct tangible reward for effort. That is why you saw and were surprised that we "Got 'Er Done!" with relative zeal and efficiency.

It doesn't have to be over the top or at a level that is game breaking(too much loot) because that is almost as non beneficial, in the long run, as none or too little reward in the sustainable long run. Reward has to be balanced just like anything else that is core to a balanced game. Need an example? Look at various Theme Park MMOs and the repeated dungeon grind for the newest gear, not to mention the grind to get to that point. Players will run dungeons over and over to get particular rewards. You see it with the higher level(T3 drops) escalations in this game. It is right in front of you as basically one of the only reasons that you have 85%, or more, of the players that you still have active right now.

If you absolutely have to push this end game siege warfare stuff, please do not forget this fundamental winning psychology of gamer mentality. This causing(in a minor way) Bulk Resources to become more important(valued) is probably the best thing that you will get out of this, right now, with such a small population.
Holdings: If you want to encourage Holdings to be built and "plussed up" specifically, you will have to better balance the cost to maintain them with more tangible rewards. It has been proven that PVP tactics can easily overcome a high "plussed" Holding or outpost. Edit: Even with a less than 2 attacker to 1 defender advantage and "tactically" we have not even gotten started. Just not worth the effort/cost otherwise.
Settlement Buildings: While we can roam about and train wherever we please, the high cost/effort to construct more buildings inside more settlements and the low population will be a "lame duck" venture. Every group alliance already has at least one spot that is pretty much maxed out for those training needs.
Incentive: Yes some groups do likely have(no logistical details yet) the capability to conduct a siege, though none most likely have an active player for each siege camp or holding, lol. What is the reward though? A ruined, flat, parking lot and a very pissed off group of players that can return the favor? A group that could, because "sloppy unfinished mechanics" disperse to 10 different settlements for support and still be a focused active group after it all? Seems less than useless measured against the cost and repercussions ingame and metagame. <–Company hopping in less than a few minutes, universal support everywhere as long as a player starved settlement will take you, excessive dead account influence problems here maybe? Build in some immediate tangible rewards for successful sieging. They could be bank looting. They SHOULD be capturing some valuable buildings, at the minimum. They could be a number of things but they have to be there.

Bottom line is that if you do make expensive(materially and effort wise) mechanics that are only as rewarding as creating conflict without reward(and possibly cause rage quitting for lost settlements), then you are only continuing with the same unfortunate, misguided design that got us were we are right now.
Pardon me if this has been covered, but this threadnaught is (understandably) getting huge.

I moved all my stuff to Thornkeep months ago in anticipation of this, but I worry that there are a thousand players with their stuff in settlements that will fall, and then, even if the game is rescued, they aren't going to want to come back to the loss of 8 months or a year of loot.

Have you folks simply written off the return of those who left?
At this point, I really don't think that you will see many sieges. Maybe a cpl to try it out but with so few bodies around, that will be an even more tedious undertaking. Anyways, why? Just to watch the World Burn? The Big Boys have multiple settlements yet no one to live in them. Not sure if you were referring to ^that^ or the few of us suggesting a wipe! smile
Or forget all of the harder stuff about doing complex things right now. Go Buy to Play($15) with a Freemium plan that gives subscribers a boost % on xp over time, an extra earning character and whatever else you could do easily in a non PTW cash shop. It's a niche game but there IS A NICHE pond for it that is untapped.

Just get some rewards in for PVP and do the above. You will increase your player base many fold. You will have $$$ to get some needed work done much more easily, IMO anyway.
If this is just gonna flatten settlements and trash what little of the player base is left, then I am sorry to say this, but just start over right now or reset the world.
I swear that many times I have thought it would make far more sense to scrap everything and start with 1-3 NPC Cities on a much smaller map. We could just be "Player Companies" going out and throwing down Holdings to farm resources and for bases to work from. Contesting against each other in a much smaller world for the time being…
Thanks for the reply for the training permissions question. I grasp that more complicated permissions require more code, I understand that code complexity and creation is beyond my personal grasp. I think mostly in terms of modular design of complex systems. It seems like you have inherited a set of systems that is far from easy to adjust or add to.

Now about Sieges: More accurately, about quality of life inside GW's game world. Basic things that MMO players expect to find in games that they pay subscriptions for. The list of regular, simple features and conveniences that are not there is pretty large. I am not just rage posting about Friend's Lists and easier Chat Features or even ingame mail OR simple PM systems HERE on your game forum site. Nor am I just rage posting about things like even rudimentary LoS mechanics, fall damage, frustrating and terribly unbalanced feud/influence mechanics or the horror(because it is an unfun and boring CHORE <–not great design for a game) of moving Bulk Resources. I am posting(not raging) about improving EVERY player's day to day enjoyment inside your game world.

What I think that we are resisting about "Siege Mechanics" is that the entire "War/Feud" implementation is WONKY already and there are about 1 million things we would rather hear about, upcoming, than unneeded stuff. I am not sure if that is because the base systems laid down in the initial stages were designed for a game that never showed up, that we are not playing that game right or that they were never well planned to scale with population levels. WE THE PLAYERS are, always have been, REALLY frustrated by these things. Whole groups have left the game because of it. Many single players have left because the whole PVP concept is not working. It was, at it's base, conceived and designed with the concepts of: Settlement Support for skills, Allowance of Refusing Services at the Settlement level, Reasonable Checks and Balances on Feuding and Influence and HIGH VALUE to the things that are produced at Holdings. When these things were not followed through on, the entire SYSTEM(all working parts) became an unbalanced mess.

If you need an example of how WONKY things are, take a look at the situation that fits for almost EVERY "Group": We are probably 6-10 active players(this is Alliance total, not even settlement) running around with the companies and influence to make feud and war as if we were several HUNDREDS of individual players. "What the..?"
This sudden determination to put in the Capstone feature of settlement "takeover" looks pretty much like another wonky piece on top of a wonky set of unbalanced systems because nothing underneath it is balanced or works in a sensible fashion.

I am hoping that you have some idea on how to improve day to day play, ingame, for all of your players. There are MANY examples and some of them are good ideas right in this thread. So, if you HAVE TO DO this, "because", then PLEASE follow it up with some things to improve EVERY PLAYER's experience on a day to day basis. Most importantly, communicate with us to give us things to look forward to. Regular play experiences that make me want to come back and log in every time that I can. I want to feel addicted to PfO again…
While I am all for activities that players would find enjoyable, I can't help be wonder if this idea is a little rough around the edges. You would need a GM to be present daily or weekly, hand out "special gear" to each participant and record the names and gear handed out, finally retrieve the gear at the end of the bouts- checking off all the names and items. This AFTER special non destructible gear is coded for a single recurring event with no idea how long it would be popular.
If there were enough population and enough wanted it, a special rules dueling arena would be the thing to ask for. Open PVP and no durability loss once you step onto the sands…

Why not push for some open PVP hexes instead and bite the bullet on the wear and tear OR do your dueling on the test server???