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All posts created by Flari-Merchant

I've looked over the numbers for harvesting and gathering, and they do look a little underwhelming. The harvesting numbers are certainly very compelling in a lot of cases, but as expressed here, they often seem like just a small bump up in efficiency. I think the crux of the problem is that I'm using the original numbers for harvesting, but the gathering numbers were hacked to be doubled until harvesting was implemented. I'm loathe to slow down harvesting at this point, as the current gathering rewards don't seem too out-of-whack with the rewards for killing mobs and tackling escalations (in terms of rewards over time for similarly skilled characters). As such, I'm looking at doubling the number of resource cycles and halving the time between resource cycles for harvesting, meaning that you'd harvest twice as much in the same amount of time. There would still certainly be plenty of cases where a T3 gatherer wouldn't want to bother with T1 harvesting, but overall harvesting would be a lot more profitable. I'd also leave the drain on the hex's resources at 100, so the efficiency there would be more pronounced (since you'd get at least 200 resources out if the harvesting operation completes, and often more like 400-500).

Now you are getting into mule required territory for lone harvesters. I like it.
A meteor hex will give 20-25 adamantine before degrading… so an adamantine or platinum gusher is a great thing, also for ghostwood type forester harvesting as 200-300 gusher is a 9x-10x output compared to responsible top level harvesting, and at a cost of at worst only double the time (depending on hex, some are slower some quicker to take all the top level but I budget 30 minutes in hex on average unless there is a high level escalation present) but for essence probably not that interesting, or things like some T3 forester resources that can give 140 odd in top level.

On the one hand, some of these numbers will have changed a bit with the reallocation of gathering resources coming in EE 13. In most cases, that will mean there's a bit more of some rarer resources, but your point certainly holds that some things get degraded quickly.

Of course, Harvesting still drains the resource, and by quite a bit, as soon as you deploy the Harvesting Kit. However, if you manage to survive the full production cycle, you'll produce more resources than you depleted from the hex, so that's a pretty good tradeoff. Still, just the act of putting down the Harvesting Kit could degrade a resource substantially below what you would intentionally do while gathering, so take care when harvesting really rare resources.
Very few resources have 100+ pieces in any given hex. The exception being essences. Most any kit deployed that takes 100 of anything will damage that hex beyond responsible gathering levels if it takes one specific type of resource.

Edit: How perfectly redundant of me! smile
That said, we do want to make sure that the payoff is compelling…, so I'm open to arguments if the payoff seems like it would rarely be compelling.

I think the problem is that I, personally, had the expectation that Gushers would provide some multiple of value/time, rather than a modest percentage bonus to value/time.

As it stands now, it feels like we're talking about a 15% improvement at the cost (yes, it's a benefit to some) of fighting a bunch of mobs.

That implies that gathering 200 or so T3 resources over 40-45 minutes is fairly typical (or at least not very unusual) for high-level gatherers, assuming a decent hex for the chosen resource. Does that sound about right?

I can answer that with a no. Not straight T3. However "several" T3 gatherers probably could in the right places. I think that we are going to have to see if it comes to pass that the extra bodies feel it is worth the time and personal cost to them, to do the fighting to protect the materials. Who can say at this point? A limit of 10 critters max per wave does sound a bit better, so thanks for that! smile

We have to keep in mind that the kits are not individually expensive. We do get to see what kind of gusher it is. We do get to decide when to deploy and when not to. Hell, we can even wait to try a T3 hex when it has a T1 escalation in it.

Seems like the main issue is that we were all thinking that gushers would be a bit more… gushy. Something requiring a mule trip or two. IMO, we have lots of options and if they are not going to be "super rare" then we can pick and choose.
To a certain degree, they basically are meant to be just a way to get more of certain resources out of a hex faster using a different kind of effort (fighting creatures). That said, we do want to make sure that the payoff is compelling, particularly if you find a Harvesting Node for the highest tier you're able to gather, so I'm open to arguments if the payoff seems like it would rarely be compelling.

You need to possibly consider that as escalations go, each group doing them usually has a method, some plan for each group they tackle and finally players choose the groups that they tackle. The toughest escalations are going to be the ones that most groups will not want to tangle with wave after stronger wave of NPCs. The mostest bad A$$ critters will wipe whole parties because they will be uncontrolled conditions. A great deal of resources will be used more quickly than normal and so used up very early. Power will run out. Pots, grenades and all tokens will get used with no time to break and get more. If it takes a few gear hits and maybe too many resources to do, even a payoff of 300 Truesilver Ore will seem like an unworthy prize for an hour's hard work for 6 players.

On the other hand, we get to choose when to throw a kit down so there is that. I just feel that gushers found in dangerous places will not be used either.
@ Bob

Is it a correct assumption that monster waves will just spawn in the way that guards do when an outpost or holding is attacked?
Will each live(and close enough) NPC contribute points toward wrecking the…. "Gusher Shack" or is there a different plan?
You have answered one other question I had. Thanks!

You can find and must place it but need not stay around to protect and collect. That makes a possible new revenue stream.
Theory on Gusher Mat Quantity: I think that the idea is to have "more" Gushers pop than would be "super rare", allowing more players to enjoy them, which means that the Lootz recovered from them needs be fairly "low" so resource materials do not become too easily obtained and wreck their value.
@ Bob,

Some of the newest recipes are restricted to drops from escalations, obviously as you have written such, but are the more regular crafting recipes on the larger random drop lists? I ask because though I don't do many escalations anymore, I do kill MANY critters while gathering and haven't seen a single "new" recipe yet.
Since it looks like I can craft +3 expert's kits for well under 50c/ea(based on opportunity/cost of just selling the raw mats to build it) and get 200-300 T1 pieces(of my preference) with a bit of fighting in an hour, I find the concept well worth the effort.

This doesn't take into account this mechanic adding to PVP opportunities yet, but between raiding and raiding those suffering NPC Invasion, I think I like it well enough. I do still wish that it could be much more product to FEEL like a gusher.

It does seem like it will add to the daily fun and opportunity for gatherers, crafters-merchants and even in general.

Thumbs Up from this peanut! smile
You are a Troll
It can't be Level 10, that is the *dead level* and requires hardly any Bulk to maintain AND offers very little in regards to support. If you can't manage level 14 as a settlement, then you aren't really playing the game IMHO. Also, several power blocks have multiple settlements under their control and therefore have at least one that is high enough level to field a crier.
That's true, but what is the whole point of the Town Crier?

Also what is the whole overall Paizo strategy about settlements? I am starting to believe that the overall strategy is to "shrink" the number of settlements in control of the current number of players. To actually get us to bunch up and consolidate more into large groups with less actual settlements. That isn't necessarily a "Bad Strategy". It would open up more settlements for new players to have a chance at, but is it realistic to expect "Us" to easily do that?

Can we do that and still maintain enough hexes to support settlements at or around lvl 20? New players in control of settlements will need some of those hexes. Conflict could be caused by this, for sure, and that would be great. Are any of us even in the same alliance willing to give up our cities though? Every hill has a mini king and mini kings guard their sovereignty tightly. Even if it is meager.

It has to be possible to grow in the same atmosphere as everyone else. Whether you started in early, early Alpha or EE or in the future. Limiting game tools to recruit players seems counter productive AND counter intuitive.