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All posts created by Flari-Merchant

It would be nice if impactful things could be done to the actual character that is causing the issue rather than having to accelerate towards full war to get at them. Since alignment is pretty much lip service to any but heavy RP players, it would be kind of nice to not feel pressured to kick players from companies and/or settlements when they do "naughty things".

What could be done if Influence was purely a character based metric? It moved with the characters and got spent by characters. It could still cumulatively be something which companies used, for "banking"(read placing holdings) but wasn't used for feuding or sieges.
Duffy Swiftshadow
Aside from each possible action needing impact, I think the scale of the actions one can take needs to be impactful and needs some variety over 'all or nothing' of holding/sieges.

Going over what we have available today:

The 'gank' is usually a very low impact (pride is hurt more often than not) outside of very narrow and specific circumstances. Ganking someone after an escalation boss kill can have a solid impact, but is very tricky to setup and generally happens by accident or with a big helping of lucky timing. Contesting an escalation is an even more awkward engagement as it boils down to either who runs out of time to keep playing first (or gets fed up) or a brawl at the boss, the latter can be interesting but due to the effort required for escalations happens rarely.

Ganking a gatherer can be potentially impactful, but catching one is very difficult and relies on luck along with what is actually 'lost' often being of minor consequence in the end.

Some of this could be resolved if stealth was far more actively usable, today it's mainly only useful as a passive ambush setup. Someone running around full speed will spot you eventually while you try to stealthily scout. Additionally a method to find and detect players within a few hexes (even if it's not particular precise) would remove the huge Luck factor from creating these mini engagements.

Feuds, while making ganking easier due to guards staying out of it and no rep hits, still falls under the previous issues as far as the 'gank' is concerned. The other property of feuds allows holding warfare and soon sieges (which boil down to the same day to day conflict mechanic) has potential for huge impact but focuses around some very mechanically unfun combat and very time consuming activity for what in many cases may be an overblown reaction. Additionally, the loss of a holding is usually a temporary state with little to no long term impact.

Therefore as of today about the only personal scale impact that seems to really matter to anyone is losing their loot from an escalation they spent hours on, which is rare and extremely difficult to pull off or maybe losing a full inventory of gathered resources which is still somewhat low impact. Finally, potentially losing a settlement is very impactful, but involves a potentially brutal slog over what may be minor or personal vendettas.

The new mechanics coming up next patch do a lot to improve the territory aspect, both defensively and with giving some actual control over the territory we claim with holdings:

The security rating feature is nice and potentially removes rep hits under some circumstances, these are not ultimately that helpful to solving the problem of reasonable impact and ability to catch each other doing some activity.

Blacklisting helps reduce safe harbors, which does slightly increase the odds of catching someone with loot that could impact them, but it's still difficult to impossible to find and catch someone without a large dose of luck.

Ultimately while both features are nice, a bit helpful, and important, they don't resolve any of the major issues outlined.

I think we need three tools to really help with this: something that requires active effort and consumables (and training) but can detect players in a much larger radius than visual sight (tracking, divination, etc… ), tweaks to stealth to go with said detection, and something like the originally proposed assassination mechanic that costs influence for a personal scale effect if you can find and kill your target regardless of what they might be carrying.

I left out raiding as a mechanic because we already know it's on the road-map and it will also give a much needed small avenue for needling opponents.

I would prefer to avoid passive systems. Maybe something in hexes you have holdings could skirt by a bit, but I'm hesitant if it's anything more that a slight heads up if you happen to be paying attention at the right time.

Ok, tools to be able to "see"(locate) other players in larger areas. Tools to allow counters for the first tool. Tools for assassination to… put a gimp on a player for a certain time?
Or to turn the question on its head is the whole idea of controlling territory\resources\whathaveya just not worth doing in this game? Does anyone even want conflict to resolve? I get the feeling that most of the remaining player base is just happy to wander the map doing escalations and gathering and such and feels that any attempt to limit this is like stealing their 15 bucks. Not knocking on any sides here, I'm just asking if this is a conversation even worth having?

I have real doubts that PVE alone, as it is and no offence to GW, is enough to keep new players satisfied. Not sure why GW decided to go the route that they have, except these upcoming things are realistic for the current situation, but I an still confused as to what sort of niche within a niche they are shooting for. Maybe a niche within a niche needs no real definition.

It is certain though to me that lacking more developed PVE content PVP is very much needed to get more bodies playing this.
If you don't know who they are, can't catch them, and don't have enough pull to get someone else to enforce your will, you don't get a say in what someone is doing.

I agree. This whole situation is also exacerbated because the population is tiny and the land is wide.
It's in the title. How/what does this game need that will make resolving smaller conflicts both satisfying and impactful?

If we are talking about how to deal with players that harass your company, pick flowers in your private garden, knock out your escalations while you sleep or do anything that needs resolving or strong disincentive are there better tools than we now(or shortly will have) to accomplish that?

So far everything we have to protect our interests leads ultimately to a war stance. The Ultimate Answer is war. Even for small things like nabbing a few platinum, snatching Nhur late night, etc…

Coming soon we have some more tools.
*Blacklisting: We will be able to inconvenience all from players up to whole settlements. This can be expanded further if Alliances or even settlements outside Grand Alliances agree to boycott as a "Large Group".
*Low Security Hexes: We will be able to get players that we catch picking our flowers and deal justice on the spot, if we have the ability, that is.

One half of these new tools are heavily dependent on knowing Who your "culprit" is. One half is dependent on being able to catch players in the act and having the skills to do something traumatic on the spot.

Are they enough? Any ideas on some better tools? Does the entire system need to be reworked? Can Influence be saved?
Is this really supposed to be a topic about escalations being finished when some people are sleeping? After this update, you will have more power to protect "your hexes" than you have ever had. You know what though? I'll bet that there will still just be bitching in Gen Chat instead of action.

Some people really DO SOMETHING when they are poked and prodded. Some just wail.

I don't mean to come off as a dick here, but the idea that neglected escalations being attended to at hours that are "off schedule" for you being a bad thing is getting old. ALL TIME ZONES DESERVE CONTENT. Trust me. They will cycle back. If you have to clean some hexes that are less than optimal to see that happen… well that is too bad.

You think I am being short and rude? Don't call my Aussie mates unwashed.
I have a T3 archer but I almost never use him unless all other PVE characters(that I might use) are so far away that it is ridiculous.
To be honest though, from a Golarion lore/roleplay point of view this game is getting well away from the original river freedoms and "you have what you hold". Golarion is meant to be a place opposed to absentee lords off somewhere else laying down rules and restrictions and controlling great slabs of territory and settlements in absentia but this game seems to be tending more and more that way.

The Riverfolk do indeed tend to be resistant to things that violate their personal interpretations of the River Freedoms, but that doesn't stop plenty of folks from trying to enforce whatever rules they wish. The Hellknights, for example, are very keen on bringing law to the River Kingdoms, regardless of what the Riverfolk might prefer. Of course, they have to be able to hold their territory to even have a shot at that, and even that's no guarantee that everyone will cooperate.

Wasn't Kingmaker set in the River Kingdoms? An adventure Path about setting up a Kingdom? Dang but that word Kingdom comes up often doesn't it? The River Kingdom Folk must be pretty upset about all that "Kingdom" stuff everywhere…

They must be doubly disturbed that no one is making these "Lords" Hold what They Have. Which pretty much is the same as only having what you hold. Which means they are doing what is expected. I think. So far anyway…. I'm sooo confused!
Thanks, Bob. Very glad that you included in stuff for newer players. smile